Libertarianism v Collectivism - Page 3 - OzChess

**Just2Good** · 11-06-2009, 01:24 PM

Originally Posted by Iconoclast

So, tone down the agro to the level down from 6/10 to 2/10.

To be fair Matt, I have seen and discussed with Axiom a very harsh expletive ridden message he sent to hobsonbay player (and which I hope he has learned from as it was quite uncivil).

This is not a one sided dispute between them.

That said, I wish each of them would put the other on their Ignore List if they can't get along. In any event decisions on banning are now left to our elected moderators!

**hobsonbay player** · 11-06-2009, 03:18 PM

l'd like to say AO that l have more faith in other two young mods given
bias Jaydon shows .Perhaps you should exclude him from making any decison
in this case as there is conflict of interest thats if you want see good
ethics maintain by the mods and good leadership .BTW if you dont
maitaintain some standards which this place lack's at times .You'll continue
have memebers making mockery and joke of this place . lam big on maintaining some reasonable
stardards

given attitude by firegoat that maybe impossible unless there is change of the
guard at Admin level .

**hobsonbay player** · 11-06-2009, 04:39 PM

This subject got me going about slavery other night in discussing it with
Firegoat. Slavery very old term is outdated and condemned in most
civilized countries but still occurs today . But to suggest we are slaves
in this modern era is ludcrious or where conditioned at early age its more
development as we grow as person we begin understand what work mean's.
l get feeling that people dont like work or hard work and dont look at it in a
positive matter instead of hiding behide loose term in(slavery) .And
many chess players are known for that .

**Just2Good** · 11-06-2009, 06:59 PM

Originally Posted by hobsonbay player

l\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\'d like to say AO that l have more faith in other two young mods given
bias Jaydon shows .Perhaps you should exclude him from making any decison
in this case as there is conflict of interest thats if you want see good
ethics maintain by the mods and good leadership .BTW if you dont
maitaintain some standards which this place lacks at times .Youll continue
have memebers making mockery and joke of this place . lam big on maintaining some reasonable stardards given attitude by firegoat that maybe impossible unless there is change of the guard at Admin level .

I am not entirely sure where to begin here.

In your dispute with Axiom, I feel as though (rightly or wrongly) that I am stuck between a rock and a hard place.

As you can see from the stats at the bottom of the homepage, he is OzChess top poster and top shouter.

These facts in particular make it much more difficult to deal with Axiom. That said, undoubtedly, there has been a sharper edge to Ax in recent weeks - and I fully understand the offence you took when he started the provocation by telling you to become educated and/or informed.

If its any consolation, I think he has said the same of me and others. I, however, believe myself to be more informed than Axiom - and as such I did not take any offence to his remark/suggestion.

In conclusion, I agree with you that Administrators should not ban or threaten to ban anyone apart from spammers, and in my view this extends to myself, MOZ, and Firegoat7.

I think when unelected Admins ban people and threaten to ban people, it undermines the worthwhileness of electing moderators. So far I think all 3 mods have done a good job, including Jaydon. And while there may be bias by one mod or another, they have wisely been reluctant to ban anybody (with the exception of the brief shoutbox bans).

I guess the bottomline is that with your dispute with Axiom, and other disputes other posters may have with one another - I am going to do what has served Switzerland very well, namely remain neutral and not get involved.

Moderation is simply no longer my cross to bare.

**hobsonbay player** · 11-06-2009, 08:42 PM

AO, l appreciate your honesty in trying keep this from turning into
all in personal war between ax and l ,but issue is not about being
a top poster its how you treat people because anyone can be a top
poster at end of day . Without a Apology from him this may not go
away . l've offered a olive branch to AX which he won't except . If he
just sent me email all this can be forgotten its not much to ask . AO
you might let things go over your head which at times l do too, but
sometimes you have to make a stand too which in this case lam .

**Axiom** · 11-06-2009, 08:59 PM

Originally Posted by hobsonbay player

AO, l appreciate your honesty in trying keep this from turning into
all in personal war between ax and l ,but issue is not about being
a top poster its how you treat people because anyone can be a top
poster at end of day . Without a Apology from him this may not go
away . l've offered a olive branch to AX which he won't except . If he
just sent me email all this can be forgotten its not much to ask . AO
you might let things go over your head which at times l do too, but
sometimes you have to make a stand too which in this case lam .

Judas , informant, rat , we know your despicable history , its all here .
Judas !

Don't be hoodwinked folks by this arch stalking treacherous anti SCT troll .

**Just2Good** · 11-06-2009, 09:04 PM

Originally Posted by Axiom

Judas , informant, rat , we know your despicable history , its all here .
Judas !

Don\\\'t be hoodwinked folks by this arch stalking treacherous anti SCT troll .

Ax, for starters you shouldn't be calling people Judas. Secondly, if an olive branch is being extended to you, I think you accept it graciously.

The above post seems very petty to me

**Axiom** · 11-06-2009, 09:08 PM

Originally Posted by Just2Good

Ax, for starters you shouldn\'t be calling people Judas. Secondly, if an olive branch is being extended to you, I think you accept it graciously.

The above post seems very petty to me

I have told Judas repeatedly that a public apology for his betrayal is all i want in return for his most vile of acts .
Hardly an unreasonable position .

**hobsonbay player** · 11-06-2009, 10:17 PM

The only unreasonabe person is now is you . l've tried to movefoward
with Olive branch to you, dont be stubborn or too proud . But if you look
seriously what you say you treat people with contempt and when things dont
go your way you turn on them . lam willing to forgive and not let this
drag on any further . l really hope you can do the same !

**Axiom** · 11-06-2009, 10:24 PM

Originally Posted by hobsonbay player

The only unreasonabe person is now is you . l've tried to movefoward
with Olive branch to you, dont be stubborn or too proud . But if you look
seriously what you say you treat people with contempt and when things dont
go your way you turn on them . lam willing to forgive and not let this
drag on any further . l really hope you can do the same !

where is the public apology ?

**hobsonbay player** · 11-06-2009, 10:57 PM

l dont need to do it simply not warranted it was between you and l no one
else . l Dont need to explain any more . AO can see lam trying why cant you ?
Is this why you dont have many friends only some people here.
You stay up to all hours in morning get up late in afternoon which is
not good for you any wonder you're like way you are.

**Axiom** · 11-06-2009, 11:22 PM

Originally Posted by hobsonbay player

l dont need to do it simply not warranted it was between you and l no one
else . l Dont need to explain any more . AO can see lam trying why cant you ?
Is this why you dont have many friends only some people here.
You stay up to all hours in morning get up late in afternoon which is
not good for you any wonder you're like way you are.

it damn well is warranted you treacherous two faced rat .
and unless it is produced within 24 hrs you will continue to feel the full force of the blade .

and here again the vile crime of judas :

[deanhogg 11-09-2009 11:30 PM]You will not believe this ax wanted me to post something

this is informing , you had been privy to sensitive information thus makes you a vile traitor and judas .

and sorry to bore folks with is , but i cannot stand idly by whilst this personification of deceit and evil runs amok defaming the good name of the ax unchallenged.

**Iconoclast** · 11-07-2009, 12:25 AM

I reckon our hobson bay poster is ...... Kevin Bonham

**Axiom** · 11-07-2009, 12:34 AM

Originally Posted by Iconoclast

I reckon our hobson bay poster is ...... Kevin Bonham

to be fair to kb , he may miss the big picture a lot but i don't think he's that good an actor to pull off the complete dolt .

**hobsonbay player** · 11-07-2009, 01:26 AM

Your constant abuse on me and is a reflection on you . You really
seem a trouble person at times ,you have hate, bitterness , And really
have trouble listening to people . To suggest lam dolt or anything else
You dont know me that well .l can talk about alot of subjects . l'am great
fan of ABC tv and ABC radio and newspaper's but not nonsense you dish up
l'am informed but on different level than you'll ever be . Most important
thing is keeping everything in perspective which you dont .You simply
go off half cock at anything you find on net .What gets me most you so drawn
into everything you read , l'd expect that from teenager . But you are so
narrow minded you believe everything you read but cant put it in few
sentences . Take reality check Mr recluse

11-06-2009, 01:24 PM	#31 (permalink)
Just2Good Tin Cup Champ 2004 Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Cairns Posts: 6,056 ICC Handle: Advantage FICS Handle: Advantage	Ax and HBP Dispute Originally Posted by Iconoclast So, tone down the agro to the level down from 6/10 to 2/10. To be fair Matt, I have seen and discussed with Axiom a very harsh expletive ridden message he sent to hobsonbay player (and which I hope he has learned from as it was quite uncivil). This is not a one sided dispute between them. That said, I wish each of them would put the other on their Ignore List if they can't get along. In any event decisions on banning are now left to our elected moderators! __________________ . "You never change things by fighting the existing reality. To change something, build a new model that makes the existing model obsolete." ~ Buckminster Fuller ~

11-06-2009, 04:39 PM	#33 (permalink)
hobsonbay player Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2008 Posts: 179	slavery This subject got me going about slavery other night in discussing it with Firegoat. Slavery very old term is outdated and condemned in most civilized countries but still occurs today . But to suggest we are slaves in this modern era is ludcrious or where conditioned at early age its more development as we grow as person we begin understand what work mean's. l get feeling that people dont like work or hard work and dont look at it in a positive matter instead of hiding behide loose term in(slavery) .And many chess players are known for that .

11-06-2009, 06:59 PM	#34 (permalink)
Just2Good Tin Cup Champ 2004 Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Cairns Posts: 6,056 ICC Handle: Advantage FICS Handle: Advantage	Neutrality is J2Gs Policy. Originally Posted by hobsonbay player l\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\'d like to say AO that l have more faith in other two young mods given bias Jaydon shows .Perhaps you should exclude him from making any decison in this case as there is conflict of interest thats if you want see good ethics maintain by the mods and good leadership .BTW if you dont maitaintain some standards which this place lacks at times .Youll continue have memebers making mockery and joke of this place . lam big on maintaining some reasonable stardards given attitude by firegoat that maybe impossible unless there is change of the guard at Admin level . I am not entirely sure where to begin here. In your dispute with Axiom, I feel as though (rightly or wrongly) that I am stuck between a rock and a hard place. As you can see from the stats at the bottom of the homepage, he is OzChess top poster and top shouter. These facts in particular make it much more difficult to deal with Axiom. That said, undoubtedly, there has been a sharper edge to Ax in recent weeks - and I fully understand the offence you took when he started the provocation by telling you to become educated and/or informed. If its any consolation, I think he has said the same of me and others. I, however, believe myself to be more informed than Axiom - and as such I did not take any offence to his remark/suggestion. In conclusion, I agree with you that Administrators should not ban or threaten to ban anyone apart from spammers, and in my view this extends to myself, MOZ, and Firegoat7. I think when unelected Admins ban people and threaten to ban people, it undermines the worthwhileness of electing moderators. So far I think all 3 mods have done a good job, including Jaydon. And while there may be bias by one mod or another, they have wisely been reluctant to ban anybody (with the exception of the brief shoutbox bans). I guess the bottomline is that with your dispute with Axiom, and other disputes other posters may have with one another - I am going to do what has served Switzerland very well, namely remain neutral and not get involved. Moderation is simply no longer my cross to bare. __________________ . "You never change things by fighting the existing reality. To change something, build a new model that makes the existing model obsolete." ~ Buckminster Fuller ~

11-06-2009, 08:42 PM	#35 (permalink)
hobsonbay player Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2008 Posts: 179	behaviour AO, l appreciate your honesty in trying keep this from turning into all in personal war between ax and l ,but issue is not about being a top poster its how you treat people because anyone can be a top poster at end of day . Without a Apology from him this may not go away . l've offered a olive branch to AX which he won't except . If he just sent me email all this can be forgotten its not much to ask . AO you might let things go over your head which at times l do too, but sometimes you have to make a stand too which in this case lam .

11-06-2009, 08:59 PM	#36 (permalink)
Axiom Reality Analyst Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Australia Posts: 3,498	Originally Posted by hobsonbay player AO, l appreciate your honesty in trying keep this from turning into all in personal war between ax and l ,but issue is not about being a top poster its how you treat people because anyone can be a top poster at end of day . Without a Apology from him this may not go away . l've offered a olive branch to AX which he won't except . If he just sent me email all this can be forgotten its not much to ask . AO you might let things go over your head which at times l do too, but sometimes you have to make a stand too which in this case lam . Judas , informant, rat , we know your despicable history , its all here . Judas ! Don't be hoodwinked folks by this arch stalking treacherous anti SCT troll . __________________ "Sometimes the obligation of the intelligent is to restate the obvious. None more important than emphatically stating that there is a : ' Naked Emperor Elephant in the Room' " Axiom

11-06-2009, 03:18 PM	#32 (permalink)
hobsonbay player Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2008 Posts: 179	l'd like to say AO that l have more faith in other two young mods given bias Jaydon shows .Perhaps you should exclude him from making any decison in this case as there is conflict of interest thats if you want see good ethics maintain by the mods and good leadership .BTW if you dont maitaintain some standards which this place lack's at times .You'll continue have memebers making mockery and joke of this place . lam big on maintaining some reasonable stardards given attitude by firegoat that maybe impossible unless there is change of the guard at Admin level .

11-06-2009, 09:04 PM	#37 (permalink)
Just2Good Tin Cup Champ 2004 Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Cairns Posts: 6,056 ICC Handle: Advantage FICS Handle: Advantage	Be Nice! Originally Posted by Axiom Judas , informant, rat , we know your despicable history , its all here . Judas ! Don\\\'t be hoodwinked folks by this arch stalking treacherous anti SCT troll . Ax, for starters you shouldn't be calling people Judas. Secondly, if an olive branch is being extended to you, I think you accept it graciously. The above post seems very petty to me __________________ . "You never change things by fighting the existing reality. To change something, build a new model that makes the existing model obsolete." ~ Buckminster Fuller ~

11-06-2009, 09:08 PM	#38 (permalink)
Axiom Reality Analyst Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Australia Posts: 3,498	Originally Posted by Just2Good Ax, for starters you shouldn\'t be calling people Judas. Secondly, if an olive branch is being extended to you, I think you accept it graciously. The above post seems very petty to me I have told Judas repeatedly that a public apology for his betrayal is all i want in return for his most vile of acts . Hardly an unreasonable position . __________________ "Sometimes the obligation of the intelligent is to restate the obvious. None more important than emphatically stating that there is a : ' Naked Emperor Elephant in the Room' " Axiom

11-06-2009, 10:17 PM	#39 (permalink)
hobsonbay player Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2008 Posts: 179	unreasonable The only unreasonabe person is now is you . l've tried to movefoward with Olive branch to you, dont be stubborn or too proud . But if you look seriously what you say you treat people with contempt and when things dont go your way you turn on them . lam willing to forgive and not let this drag on any further . l really hope you can do the same !

11-06-2009, 10:24 PM	#40 (permalink)
Axiom Reality Analyst Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Australia Posts: 3,498	Originally Posted by hobsonbay player The only unreasonabe person is now is you . l've tried to movefoward with Olive branch to you, dont be stubborn or too proud . But if you look seriously what you say you treat people with contempt and when things dont go your way you turn on them . lam willing to forgive and not let this drag on any further . l really hope you can do the same ! where is the public apology ? __________________ "Sometimes the obligation of the intelligent is to restate the obvious. None more important than emphatically stating that there is a : ' Naked Emperor Elephant in the Room' " Axiom

11-06-2009, 10:57 PM	#41 (permalink)
hobsonbay player Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2008 Posts: 179	not justified l dont need to do it simply not warranted it was between you and l no one else . l Dont need to explain any more . AO can see lam trying why cant you ? Is this why you dont have many friends only some people here. You stay up to all hours in morning get up late in afternoon which is not good for you any wonder you're like way you are.

11-06-2009, 11:22 PM	#42 (permalink)
Axiom Reality Analyst Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Australia Posts: 3,498	Take responsibility for your crime judas Originally Posted by hobsonbay player l dont need to do it simply not warranted it was between you and l no one else . l Dont need to explain any more . AO can see lam trying why cant you ? Is this why you dont have many friends only some people here. You stay up to all hours in morning get up late in afternoon which is not good for you any wonder you're like way you are. it damn well is warranted you treacherous two faced rat . and unless it is produced within 24 hrs you will continue to feel the full force of the blade . and here again the vile crime of judas : [deanhogg 11-09-2009 11:30 PM]You will not believe this ax wanted me to post something this is informing , you had been privy to sensitive information thus makes you a vile traitor and judas . and sorry to bore folks with is , but i cannot stand idly by whilst this personification of deceit and evil runs amok defaming the good name of the ax unchallenged. __________________ "Sometimes the obligation of the intelligent is to restate the obvious. None more important than emphatically stating that there is a : ' Naked Emperor Elephant in the Room' " Axiom

11-07-2009, 12:25 AM	#43 (permalink)
Iconoclast Immoderator Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Wollongong NSW Posts: 2,302	I reckon our hobson bay poster is ...... Kevin Bonham __________________ The individual is hopeless without the group. The group is hopeless without its individuals.

11-07-2009, 12:34 AM	#44 (permalink)
Axiom Reality Analyst Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Australia Posts: 3,498	Originally Posted by Iconoclast I reckon our hobson bay poster is ...... Kevin Bonham to be fair to kb , he may miss the big picture a lot but i don't think he's that good an actor to pull off the complete dolt . __________________ "Sometimes the obligation of the intelligent is to restate the obvious. None more important than emphatically stating that there is a : ' Naked Emperor Elephant in the Room' " Axiom

11-07-2009, 01:26 AM	#45 (permalink)
hobsonbay player Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2008 Posts: 179	peddling utter nonsense as usual Your constant abuse on me and is a reflection on you . You really seem a trouble person at times ,you have hate, bitterness , And really have trouble listening to people . To suggest lam dolt or anything else You dont know me that well .l can talk about alot of subjects . l'am great fan of ABC tv and ABC radio and newspaper's but not nonsense you dish up l'am informed but on different level than you'll ever be . Most important thing is keeping everything in perspective which you dont .You simply go off half cock at anything you find on net .What gets me most you so drawn into everything you read , l'd expect that from teenager . But you are so narrow minded you believe everything you read but cant put it in few sentences . Take reality check Mr recluse

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