Labor's Environmental Hypocrisy - OzChess

**Firegoat7** · 10-30-2007, 03:24 AM

Hi,

This election promise caught my eye.

http://www.worldnewsaustralia.com.au...41064&region=7

Whilst I agree that the Great Barrier Reef ought to be protected, as would most people. I object to the pledges implicit policy, namely, that money earmarked for natural heritage is being used to support the tourism industry and reform outdated agricultural practices.

Why should taxpayers money earmarked for conservation be used to subsidise rich farmers who have made their fortunes polluting the Great Barrier Reef. Why doesn't Labor just get tough and legislate against these outdated mono-crop farming practices that are destroying the reef with their fertilisation run offs.

Furthermore why should tourist operators and fishermen be subsidised, again by the taxpayer, to prop up business. I don't care if these industries go broke. They operate in a free market, they make a living from the free market, they should accept the consequences of the free market. They most certainly should not be rewarded with subsidies to prevent them from destroying the Barrier Reef. Our taxes should not be given to environmental vandals. Funding should definately not be stolen from the natural heritage fund to pay these people.

cheers Fg7

**Arrogant-One** · 10-30-2007, 01:39 PM

FG7

I don't know if there really is any hypocrisy demonstrated in your post, however, of all the Howard Government Ministers I like Malcolm Turnbull the best (Minister for Environment).

I think Australia needs to carefully think about whether Kyoto is worth signing. Canada signed the agreement but never once lived up to its obligations under it. In essence is Labor proposing the same thing, ie. signing a piece of paper which is a completely separate thing from actually achieving a result on curbing green house gases.

AO

**Iconoclast** · 10-30-2007, 05:31 PM

Originally Posted by Firegoat7

... money earmarked for natural heritage is being used to support the tourism industry and reform outdated agricultural practices.

Disgusting. Here we are on the cusp of [insert an invironmental horror] and it is proposed that we prop up the two of the three most damaging industries on the planet.

... again by the taxpayer, to prop up business. I don't care if these industries go broke.

As a generality I agree. There are, however, some that are too important to leave to the free market, eg education, infrastructure, defence, environment and health.

**Iconoclast** · 10-30-2007, 05:34 PM

Originally Posted by Arrogant-One

Canada signed the agreement but never once lived up to its obligations under it.

At least they had good intentions. They may fail. But we look like arseholes and when/if the sky falls, we will be first to be fingered. for the high jump.

10-30-2007, 11:55 PM

FIngering A-holes? Maybe someone has a wee fetish there, aye?

{LBC is coming... to town!}

**Iconoclast** · 10-31-2007, 04:29 PM

Originally Posted by LBC

FIngering A-holes? Maybe someone has a wee fetish there, aye?

{LBC is coming... to town!}

LMAO I honestly didn't intend that connection - purely accidental. Still LMAO

**Arrogant-One** · 10-31-2007, 08:15 PM

Originally Posted by Iconoclast

At least they had good intentions.

What do they say the road to hell is paved with again?

**Chessic-Adventures** · 11-01-2007, 08:31 PM

Did you see that scene where Kevin Rudd, presumably during question time, puts his finger in his ear, then pulls something out, and then looks at it, and then puts it in his mouth!!!

It is totally unreal. In response Kevin says there are times when we all do foolish things. Well, I can't recall ever seeing Howard do something so disgusting in full view of the cameras, and Howard has been around the hustings for a long, long time. If the Coalition is smart this will be the substance of their next wave of advertisements.

As for policy generally, am I the only one who can't really find the big and substantial differences between Labor and the Coalition at this point?

**Iconoclast** · 11-01-2007, 10:33 PM

Originally Posted by Chessic-Adventures

As for policy generally, am I the only one who can't really find the big and substantial differences between Labor and the Coalition at this point?

No you are not. However, WorkChoices is the only place the ALP (Another Liberal Party) appears to have a different and better policy.

**MerdeCat** · 11-06-2007, 04:21 PM

Interesting article Firegoat.

Thanks for posting the link.

Spiny Norman · 11-07-2007, 09:02 AM

Originally Posted by Chessic-Adventures

As for policy generally, am I the only one who can't really find the big and substantial differences between Labor and the Coalition at this point?

No, you're not alone. As pointed out, Work Choices is a big policy difference, but there's not a lot else. I think this will go down in history as the "me too" election (I point the finger at both sides here, but mostly at Labor).

The next question is this: if Labor win, will they revert to policies which we written pre-election behind closed doors, but later jettisoned in a fit of 'me too' campaigning behaviour? (e.g. Kyoto version 2) Garrett may have let the cat out of the bag on that one.

Time will tell.

**Chessic-Adventures** · 11-07-2007, 01:51 PM

Did you hear Alexander Downer complaining about Rudd speaking Chinese in a commercial? What an idiot, just because he is unilingual. That attitude just makes me annoyed. Is it just me or was that an unpopular move in general?

**Iconoclast** · 11-07-2007, 03:45 PM

Originally Posted by Spiny Norman

Garrett may have let the cat out of the bag on that one.

Narrr, the bag was always empty and the cats are roaming everywhere. 99% of politicians are lying filth.

**Iconoclast** · 11-07-2007, 03:52 PM

Originally Posted by Chessic-Adventures

Did you hear Alexander Downer complaining about Rudd speaking Chinese in a commercial? ... Is it just me or was that an unpopular move in general?

Downer should,

**Arrogant-One** · 11-07-2007, 07:15 PM

Originally Posted by Chessic-Adventures

Did you hear Alexander Downer complaining about Rudd speaking Chinese in a commercial? What an idiot, just because he is unilingual. That attitude just makes me annoyed. Is it just me or was that an unpopular move in general?

I heard him complain that Rudd was parading his Chinese, but that was at the APEC summit, not on a commercial. I agree though that its a bit of a moot point. The substance is what Rudd says should be considered more important than the language in which he says it.

10-30-2007, 03:24 AM	#1 (permalink)
Firegoat7 Playing backyard cricket Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: somewhere in virtual reality Posts: 605	Labor's Environmental Hypocrisy Hi, This election promise caught my eye. http://www.worldnewsaustralia.com.au...41064&region=7 Whilst I agree that the Great Barrier Reef ought to be protected, as would most people. I object to the pledges implicit policy, namely, that money earmarked for natural heritage is being used to support the tourism industry and reform outdated agricultural practices. Why should taxpayers money earmarked for conservation be used to subsidise rich farmers who have made their fortunes polluting the Great Barrier Reef. Why doesn't Labor just get tough and legislate against these outdated mono-crop farming practices that are destroying the reef with their fertilisation run offs. Furthermore why should tourist operators and fishermen be subsidised, again by the taxpayer, to prop up business. I don't care if these industries go broke. They operate in a free market, they make a living from the free market, they should accept the consequences of the free market. They most certainly should not be rewarded with subsidies to prevent them from destroying the Barrier Reef. Our taxes should not be given to environmental vandals. Funding should definately not be stolen from the natural heritage fund to pay these people. cheers Fg7 Last edited by Firegoat7 : 10-30-2007 at 03:25 AM Reason: spelling

10-30-2007, 01:39 PM	#2 (permalink)
Arrogant-One Tin Cup Champ 2004 Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Brisbane, Australia Posts: 1,682 ICC Handle: Just2Good FICS Handle: Advantage	Hypocrisy? FG7 I don't know if there really is any hypocrisy demonstrated in your post, however, of all the Howard Government Ministers I like Malcolm Turnbull the best (Minister for Environment). I think Australia needs to carefully think about whether Kyoto is worth signing. Canada signed the agreement but never once lived up to its obligations under it. In essence is Labor proposing the same thing, ie. signing a piece of paper which is a completely separate thing from actually achieving a result on curbing green house gases. AO __________________ . ... for it is always the person not in the predicament who knows what ought to have been done in it, and would unquestionably have done it too . . . ~ Charles Dickens novel ~

10-30-2007, 05:31 PM	#3 (permalink)
Iconoclast Immoderator Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Wollongong NSW Posts: 1,006	Originally Posted by Firegoat7 ... money earmarked for natural heritage is being used to support the tourism industry and reform outdated agricultural practices. Disgusting. Here we are on the cusp of [insert an invironmental horror] and it is proposed that we prop up the two of the three most damaging industries on the planet. ... again by the taxpayer, to prop up business. I don't care if these industries go broke. As a generality I agree. There are, however, some that are too important to leave to the free market, eg education, infrastructure, defence, environment and health. __________________ The individual is hopeless without the group. The group is hopeless without its individuals.

10-30-2007, 05:34 PM	#4 (permalink)
Iconoclast Immoderator Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Wollongong NSW Posts: 1,006	Originally Posted by Arrogant-One Canada signed the agreement but never once lived up to its obligations under it. At least they had good intentions. They may fail. But we look like arseholes and when/if the sky falls, we will be first to be fingered. for the high jump. __________________ The individual is hopeless without the group. The group is hopeless without its individuals.

10-30-2007, 11:55 PM	#5 (permalink) #5 (permalink) (View Moderation Comments)
LBC Posts: n/a	Matt!? FIngering A-holes? Maybe someone has a wee fetish there, aye? {LBC is coming... to town!}

10-31-2007, 04:29 PM	#6 (permalink)
Iconoclast Immoderator Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Wollongong NSW Posts: 1,006	Originally Posted by LBC FIngering A-holes? Maybe someone has a wee fetish there, aye? {LBC is coming... to town!} LMAO I honestly didn't intend that connection - purely accidental. Still LMAO __________________ The individual is hopeless without the group. The group is hopeless without its individuals.

10-31-2007, 08:15 PM	#7 (permalink)
Arrogant-One Tin Cup Champ 2004 Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Brisbane, Australia Posts: 1,682 ICC Handle: Just2Good FICS Handle: Advantage	Good Intentions Insufficient Originally Posted by Iconoclast At least they had good intentions. What do they say the road to hell is paved with again? __________________ . ... for it is always the person not in the predicament who knows what ought to have been done in it, and would unquestionably have done it too . . . ~ Charles Dickens novel ~

11-01-2007, 08:31 PM	#8 (permalink)
Chessic-Adventures Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Sydney Posts: 204	Kevin Rudd's Ear Did you see that scene where Kevin Rudd, presumably during question time, puts his finger in his ear, then pulls something out, and then looks at it, and then puts it in his mouth!!! It is totally unreal. In response Kevin says there are times when we all do foolish things. Well, I can't recall ever seeing Howard do something so disgusting in full view of the cameras, and Howard has been around the hustings for a long, long time. If the Coalition is smart this will be the substance of their next wave of advertisements. As for policy generally, am I the only one who can't really find the big and substantial differences between Labor and the Coalition at this point?

11-01-2007, 10:33 PM	#9 (permalink)
Iconoclast Immoderator Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Wollongong NSW Posts: 1,006	Originally Posted by Chessic-Adventures As for policy generally, am I the only one who can't really find the big and substantial differences between Labor and the Coalition at this point? No you are not. However, WorkChoices is the only place the ALP (Another Liberal Party) appears to have a different and better policy. __________________ The individual is hopeless without the group. The group is hopeless without its individuals.

11-06-2007, 04:21 PM	#10 (permalink)
MerdeCat Junior Member Join Date: Nov 2007 Posts: 13	Interesting article Firegoat. Thanks for posting the link.

11-07-2007, 09:02 AM	#11 (permalink)
Spiny Norman Suspended Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 223	Originally Posted by Chessic-Adventures As for policy generally, am I the only one who can't really find the big and substantial differences between Labor and the Coalition at this point? No, you're not alone. As pointed out, Work Choices is a big policy difference, but there's not a lot else. I think this will go down in history as the "me too" election (I point the finger at both sides here, but mostly at Labor). The next question is this: if Labor win, will they revert to policies which we written pre-election behind closed doors, but later jettisoned in a fit of 'me too' campaigning behaviour? (e.g. Kyoto version 2) Garrett may have let the cat out of the bag on that one. Time will tell.

11-07-2007, 01:51 PM	#12 (permalink)
Chessic-Adventures Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Sydney Posts: 204	Did you hear Alexander Downer complaining about Rudd speaking Chinese in a commercial? What an idiot, just because he is unilingual. That attitude just makes me annoyed. Is it just me or was that an unpopular move in general?

11-07-2007, 03:45 PM	#13 (permalink)
Iconoclast Immoderator Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Wollongong NSW Posts: 1,006	Originally Posted by Spiny Norman Garrett may have let the cat out of the bag on that one. Narrr, the bag was always empty and the cats are roaming everywhere. 99% of politicians are lying filth. __________________ The individual is hopeless without the group. The group is hopeless without its individuals.

11-07-2007, 03:52 PM	#14 (permalink)
Iconoclast Immoderator Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Wollongong NSW Posts: 1,006	Originally Posted by Chessic-Adventures Did you hear Alexander Downer complaining about Rudd speaking Chinese in a commercial? ... Is it just me or was that an unpopular move in general? Downer should, __________________ The individual is hopeless without the group. The group is hopeless without its individuals.

11-07-2007, 07:15 PM	#15 (permalink)
Arrogant-One Tin Cup Champ 2004 Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Brisbane, Australia Posts: 1,682 ICC Handle: Just2Good FICS Handle: Advantage	Substance More Important Originally Posted by Chessic-Adventures Did you hear Alexander Downer complaining about Rudd speaking Chinese in a commercial? What an idiot, just because he is unilingual. That attitude just makes me annoyed. Is it just me or was that an unpopular move in general? I heard him complain that Rudd was parading his Chinese, but that was at the APEC summit, not on a commercial. I agree though that its a bit of a moot point. The substance is what Rudd says should be considered more important than the language in which he says it. __________________ . ... for it is always the person not in the predicament who knows what ought to have been done in it, and would unquestionably have done it too . . . ~ Charles Dickens novel ~

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