Victorian Blitz Championship 2011 - Page 2 - OzChess

**Lekko** · 12-04-2011, 11:19 PM

Originally Posted by flavid dude

It was done to me at Box Hill. You have the right to push the clock. If your opponent objects then stop the clocks and call the arbiter. Do not shove the pieces off the board. If your opponent persists then take his king and claim the win because your opponent is not letting you press the clock.

If you take his king you lose

**Just2Good** · 12-05-2011, 04:31 PM

Originally Posted by the morris man

I didn't see any reason at all why I should behave 'acceptably': if Leonid could perform these clearly audible tactics with the sole intention of distracting his opponents, consistently, every round, then something is clearly wrong. I wasn't the only opponent of his (while I was there) who was clearly affected by his antics; Bobby found it extremely difficult to even move when attempting to convert his advantage in time trouble, because Leonid was making moves before Bobby had even completed his. His behavior was no more acceptable than mine, and he did it consistently.

I don't quite understand. So you moved, forgot to hit your clock, and then the Sandman moved? Is that what got you all upset?

**flavid dude** · 12-05-2011, 07:00 PM

Originally Posted by Just2Good

I don't quite understand. So you moved, forgot to hit your clock, and then the Sandman moved? Is that what got you all upset?

You move and reach across to press the clock but your opponent moves before you push the clock.

I have been told by a FIDE arbiter that your move is not completed until you press the clock and even if your opponent has moved you can still press the clock.

One trick you might try in a pawn race is to bang the Pawn up and down on the same square. If your opponent moves he has played two moves in a row and loses. A lot of players do not even look at the oppnents move in a pawn race. They just keep moving the pawn.

**The Seeing** · 12-05-2011, 08:57 PM

I think it needs to be a much more second nature type reflex to stop the clocks and call the arbiter .

It's not dobbing , it shouldn't cause undue embarrassment , it may interrupt one's concentration , it may cause an awkward moment but it is the correct way to nip these (alleged) anti-Caissa behaviours in the bud .

**Just2Good** · 12-05-2011, 11:21 PM

Originally Posted by flavid dude

You move and reach across to press the clock but your opponent moves before you push the clock.

I have been told by a FIDE arbiter that your move is not completed until you press the clock and even if your opponent has moved you can still press the clock.

One trick you might try in a pawn race is to bang the Pawn up and down on the same square. If your opponent moves he has played two moves in a row and loses. A lot of players do not even look at the oppnents move in a pawn race. They just keep moving the pawn.

I see.

In that case why not move with one hand and immediately hit your clock with the other? This would also breach the rules but would put an end to the nonsense.

**Firegoat7** · 12-05-2011, 11:46 PM

Greetings,

Excellent post by Leonid Sandler on the other forum.
Chess Chat - Australia's Premier Chess Forum - View Single Post - Victorian Blitz Championship, 2011

Originally Posted by The Sandman

Of course he was very upset(losing game where he had his chances) and left the tournament.Today we talked and he apologised.

We all make mistakes,but you need a lot of courage to admit it.

I am very happy that James ( whom I respect very much) was able to do it.

End of story

Classy move by James in my opinion, deserves serious kudos for displaying maturity beyond his years. I am sure the whole of Ozchess will be following the next chess game between Leonid "The Sandman" Sandler and James "The Man "Morris with eager anticipation.

**Lekko** · 12-06-2011, 01:04 AM

Originally Posted by Firegoat7

Greetings,

Excellent post by Leonid Sandler on the other forum.
Chess Chat - Australia's Premier Chess Forum - View Single Post - Victorian Blitz Championship, 2011

Classy move by James in my opinion, deserves serious kudos for displaying maturity beyond his years. I am sure the whole of Ozchess will be following the next chess game between Leonid "The Sandman" Sandler and James "The Man "Morris with eager anticipation.

There may be screams from a suspicious looking character in the crowd with a pair of sunnys and a mullet...

OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOH!!!!!!!!!!

**Lekko** · 12-06-2011, 01:06 AM

Originally Posted by Just2Good

I see.

In that case why not move with one hand and immediately hit your clock with the other? This would also breach the rules but would put an end to the nonsense.

Exactly, "one thing you can do"? All these sorts of things do is create more problems which are detrimental to chess in Australia, let alone Victoria.

**Just2Good** · 12-06-2011, 02:47 AM

Originally Posted by Lekko

Exactly, "one thing you can do"? All these sorts of things do is create more problems which are detrimental to chess in Australia, let alone Victoria.

I agree.

**Kerry Stead** · 12-06-2011, 04:16 AM

Originally Posted by Lekko

Exactly, "one thing you can do"? All these sorts of things do is create more problems which are detrimental to chess in Australia, let alone Victoria.

Arbiter forfeits both players ... play by the rules or shut up!

**Lekko** · 12-06-2011, 05:06 AM

Originally Posted by Kerry Stead

Arbiter forfeits both players ... play by the rules or shut up!

Can't they do both...?

**antichrist** · 12-06-2011, 08:13 AM

Originally Posted by Firegoat7

Greetings,

Excellent post by Leonid Sandler on the other forum.
Chess Chat - Australia's Premier Chess Forum - View Single Post - Victorian Blitz Championship, 2011

Classy move by James in my opinion, deserves serious kudos for displaying maturity beyond his years. I am sure the whole of Ozchess will be following the next chess game between Leonid "The Sandman" Sandler and James "The Man "Morris with eager anticipation.

Next time the Sandman may be dodging handbags - stranger things have happened

**Kerry Stead** · 12-06-2011, 02:54 PM

Originally Posted by Lekko

Can't they do both...?

Well yes, that would be the ideal course of action for all concerned, but based on JtG's hypothetical, the attitude was 'if you're breaking the rules, so will I' ...

**Just2Good** · 12-06-2011, 03:37 PM

Originally Posted by Kerry Stead

Well yes, that would be the ideal course of action for all concerned, but based on JtG's hypothetical, the attitude was 'if you're breaking the rules, so will I' ...

Yes, perhaps that is not the best approach. I was just putting it on the table for discussion.

Personally, the first time it happened, I would have stopped the clock and shouted for the arbiter to come over and then make my case.

I don't know if that is a legal thing to do or not, but options seem somewhat limited for the victim in this situation.

12-04-2011, 11:19 PM	#16 (permalink)
Lekko HBK Join Date: May 2009 Location: Melbourne Posts: 1,359 ICC Handle: Heartbreak-Kid FICS Handle: HeartBreakingKid	Originally Posted by flavid dude It was done to me at Box Hill. You have the right to push the clock. If your opponent objects then stop the clocks and call the arbiter. Do not shove the pieces off the board. If your opponent persists then take his king and claim the win because your opponent is not letting you press the clock. If you take his king you lose __________________ Originally Posted by Iconoclast Girls attract boys. more girls playing chess = many more boys playing chess

12-05-2011, 04:31 PM	#17 (permalink)
Just2Good Tin Cup Champ 2004 Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Cairns Posts: 6,233 ICC Handle: Advantage FICS Handle: Advantage	Originally Posted by the morris man I didn't see any reason at all why I should behave 'acceptably': if Leonid could perform these clearly audible tactics with the sole intention of distracting his opponents, consistently, every round, then something is clearly wrong. I wasn't the only opponent of his (while I was there) who was clearly affected by his antics; Bobby found it extremely difficult to even move when attempting to convert his advantage in time trouble, because Leonid was making moves before Bobby had even completed his. His behavior was no more acceptable than mine, and he did it consistently. I don't quite understand. So you moved, forgot to hit your clock, and then the Sandman moved? Is that what got you all upset? __________________ . "The fox knows many things, but the hedgehog knows one big thing." ~ Isaiah Berlin ~

12-05-2011, 07:00 PM	#18 (permalink)
flavid dude Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2008 Posts: 336	The problem is Originally Posted by Just2Good I don't quite understand. So you moved, forgot to hit your clock, and then the Sandman moved? Is that what got you all upset? You move and reach across to press the clock but your opponent moves before you push the clock. I have been told by a FIDE arbiter that your move is not completed until you press the clock and even if your opponent has moved you can still press the clock. One trick you might try in a pawn race is to bang the Pawn up and down on the same square. If your opponent moves he has played two moves in a row and loses. A lot of players do not even look at the oppnents move in a pawn race. They just keep moving the pawn. __________________ Box Hill Chess Club -website http://www.boxhillchess.org.au/ Canterbury Junior Chess Club -website [url]http://canterburychess.org.au/index.php

12-05-2011, 08:57 PM	#19 (permalink)
The Seeing Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2011 Posts: 263	Remember To Ask Yourself - " What Would Caissa Do ?" I think it needs to be a much more second nature type reflex to stop the clocks and call the arbiter . It's not dobbing , it shouldn't cause undue embarrassment , it may interrupt one's concentration , it may cause an awkward moment but it is the correct way to nip these (alleged) anti-Caissa behaviours in the bud .

12-05-2011, 11:21 PM	#20 (permalink)
Just2Good Tin Cup Champ 2004 Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Cairns Posts: 6,233 ICC Handle: Advantage FICS Handle: Advantage	Originally Posted by flavid dude You move and reach across to press the clock but your opponent moves before you push the clock. I have been told by a FIDE arbiter that your move is not completed until you press the clock and even if your opponent has moved you can still press the clock. One trick you might try in a pawn race is to bang the Pawn up and down on the same square. If your opponent moves he has played two moves in a row and loses. A lot of players do not even look at the oppnents move in a pawn race. They just keep moving the pawn. I see. In that case why not move with one hand and immediately hit your clock with the other? This would also breach the rules but would put an end to the nonsense. __________________ . "The fox knows many things, but the hedgehog knows one big thing." ~ Isaiah Berlin ~

12-05-2011, 11:46 PM	#21 (permalink)
Firegoat7 Moderator Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Getting owned by White in the Dragon and trying to recover lost positions from shock paralysis OTB Posts: 2,044 ICC Handle: guest	champions behave like champions Greetings, Excellent post by Leonid Sandler on the other forum. Chess Chat - Australia's Premier Chess Forum - View Single Post - Victorian Blitz Championship, 2011 Originally Posted by The Sandman Of course he was very upset(losing game where he had his chances) and left the tournament.Today we talked and he apologised. We all make mistakes,but you need a lot of courage to admit it. I am very happy that James ( whom I respect very much) was able to do it. End of story Classy move by James in my opinion, deserves serious kudos for displaying maturity beyond his years. I am sure the whole of Ozchess will be following the next chess game between Leonid "The Sandman" Sandler and James "The Man "Morris with eager anticipation. __________________ "...What I meant? Dear Mr Ian Rout (ACF news publisher) could you please put Ozchessforum in the next news letter! There is no reason to hide this forum from the Australian chess public. What they meant? Sorry, No english!- Amir Karibasic

12-06-2011, 01:04 AM	#22 (permalink)
Lekko HBK Join Date: May 2009 Location: Melbourne Posts: 1,359 ICC Handle: Heartbreak-Kid FICS Handle: HeartBreakingKid	Originally Posted by Firegoat7 Greetings, Excellent post by Leonid Sandler on the other forum. Chess Chat - Australia's Premier Chess Forum - View Single Post - Victorian Blitz Championship, 2011 Classy move by James in my opinion, deserves serious kudos for displaying maturity beyond his years. I am sure the whole of Ozchess will be following the next chess game between Leonid "The Sandman" Sandler and James "The Man "Morris with eager anticipation. There may be screams from a suspicious looking character in the crowd with a pair of sunnys and a mullet... OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOH!!!!!!!!!! __________________ Originally Posted by Iconoclast Girls attract boys. more girls playing chess = many more boys playing chess

12-06-2011, 01:06 AM	#23 (permalink)
Lekko HBK Join Date: May 2009 Location: Melbourne Posts: 1,359 ICC Handle: Heartbreak-Kid FICS Handle: HeartBreakingKid	Originally Posted by Just2Good I see. In that case why not move with one hand and immediately hit your clock with the other? This would also breach the rules but would put an end to the nonsense. Exactly, "one thing you can do"? All these sorts of things do is create more problems which are detrimental to chess in Australia, let alone Victoria. __________________ Originally Posted by Iconoclast Girls attract boys. more girls playing chess = many more boys playing chess

12-06-2011, 02:47 AM	#24 (permalink)
Just2Good Tin Cup Champ 2004 Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Cairns Posts: 6,233 ICC Handle: Advantage FICS Handle: Advantage	Originally Posted by Lekko Exactly, "one thing you can do"? All these sorts of things do is create more problems which are detrimental to chess in Australia, let alone Victoria. I agree. __________________ . "The fox knows many things, but the hedgehog knows one big thing." ~ Isaiah Berlin ~

12-06-2011, 04:16 AM	#25 (permalink)
Kerry Stead Member Join Date: Nov 2010 Posts: 67	Originally Posted by Lekko Exactly, "one thing you can do"? All these sorts of things do is create more problems which are detrimental to chess in Australia, let alone Victoria. Arbiter forfeits both players ... play by the rules or shut up!

12-06-2011, 05:06 AM	#26 (permalink)
Lekko HBK Join Date: May 2009 Location: Melbourne Posts: 1,359 ICC Handle: Heartbreak-Kid FICS Handle: HeartBreakingKid	Originally Posted by Kerry Stead Arbiter forfeits both players ... play by the rules or shut up! Can't they do both...? __________________ Originally Posted by Iconoclast Girls attract boys. more girls playing chess = many more boys playing chess

12-06-2011, 08:13 AM	#27 (permalink)
antichrist Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Byron Bay, NSW Posts: 2,821	Originally Posted by Firegoat7 Greetings, Excellent post by Leonid Sandler on the other forum. Chess Chat - Australia's Premier Chess Forum - View Single Post - Victorian Blitz Championship, 2011 Classy move by James in my opinion, deserves serious kudos for displaying maturity beyond his years. I am sure the whole of Ozchess will be following the next chess game between Leonid "The Sandman" Sandler and James "The Man "Morris with eager anticipation. Next time the Sandman may be dodging handbags - stranger things have happened

12-06-2011, 02:54 PM	#28 (permalink)
Kerry Stead Member Join Date: Nov 2010 Posts: 67	Originally Posted by Lekko Can't they do both...? Well yes, that would be the ideal course of action for all concerned, but based on JtG's hypothetical, the attitude was 'if you're breaking the rules, so will I' ...

12-06-2011, 03:37 PM	#29 (permalink)
Just2Good Tin Cup Champ 2004 Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Cairns Posts: 6,233 ICC Handle: Advantage FICS Handle: Advantage	Originally Posted by Kerry Stead Well yes, that would be the ideal course of action for all concerned, but based on JtG's hypothetical, the attitude was 'if you're breaking the rules, so will I' ... Yes, perhaps that is not the best approach. I was just putting it on the table for discussion. Personally, the first time it happened, I would have stopped the clock and shouted for the arbiter to come over and then make my case. I don't know if that is a legal thing to do or not, but options seem somewhat limited for the victim in this situation. __________________ . "The fox knows many things, but the hedgehog knows one big thing." ~ Isaiah Berlin ~

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