2009 Victorian Championships - Page 11 - OzChess

**MOZ** · 10-23-2009, 08:35 AM

Wow. Some surprises in that collection.

Code:

Below are round 5 results

Johansen-Pyke 1-0
Lindberg-Morris 1-0
Hamilton-Lee 1-0
Kildisas-Hacche 1-0
Dragicevic-Levi 0-1
Rujevic-Sandler draw

After 5 rounds
1-2 Johansen and Levi 4,5 points
3.  Morris 3 points
 4-8 Hamilton,Dragicevic,Lee,Pyke,Sandler 2,5 points each
9.Lindberg 2 points
10 Rujevic 1,5
11-12 Kildisas and Hacche 1 point each

**gbekker** · 10-23-2009, 11:25 AM

Round 3 Championship Games:

**gbekker** · 10-23-2009, 11:26 AM

Round 4 Championship Games:

**gbekker** · 10-23-2009, 11:31 AM

Round 5 Championship Games:

**Firegoat7** · 10-23-2009, 07:41 PM

Hi,

Anyone got a contact number for Gary Bekker? One of the Wijesuriya's asked for a adjournement and I am not 100% sure whether I should turn up tommorrow?

cheers,

**MOZ** · 10-24-2009, 08:17 PM

Below are results from round 6

Hacche-Johansen 0-1
Levi-Kildisas draw
Lindberg-Hamilton 1-0
Sandler-Dragicevic 1-0
Lee-Rujevic draw
Morris-Pyke draw

After 6 rounds

1.Johansen 5,5 points
2.Levi 5
3-4 Morris ,Sandler 3,5 each
5-7 Lindberg,Pyke,Lee 3 each
8-9 Hamilton,Dragicevic 2,5 each
10 Rujevic 2
11.Kildisas 1,5
12.Hacche 1

**gbekker** · 10-27-2009, 10:51 PM

Round 6 Championship games:

**Il cavaliere inesistente** · 10-28-2009, 09:20 AM

The round 7 championship results and cross table are now available on CV web site.
Follow the link: 09 Results

**Il cavaliere inesistente** · 10-28-2009, 09:39 AM

In the first round game in the reserves Flude - Beattie, Beattie arrives 45 minutes late and forfeits under the FIDE forfeit time rules. He appeals, wins the appeal and wins the game. How can one win an appeal against a seemingly clear transgression of the rules? No reasons are published.

**Firegoat7** · 10-28-2009, 10:14 AM

Originally Posted by Il cavaliere inesistente

In the first round game in the reserves Flude - Beattie, Beattie arrives 45 minutes late and forfeits under the FIDE forfeit time rules.

Hi Il cavaliere inesistente,

Fide rule 6.6a states

a.
Any player who arrives at the chessboard after the start of the session shall lose the game. Thus the default time is 0 minutes. The rules of a competition may specify otherwise.

So under the rules the default time is 0 minutes. However, tournament organisers can set a default time for an event. This was set at 30 minutes for the Victorian reserves.

Originally Posted by Il cavaliere inesistente

He appeals, wins the appeal and wins the game. How can one win an appeal against a seemingly clear transgression of the rules? No reasons are published.

Beattie appealed because previous Victorian chess events, like last years reserves tournament, had a standard default time of 1 hour. There is some suggestion that the new default time was not advertised in advance for this tournament. Therefore Beattie argued that there was no way he could have known the new default time in advance. Given that it was the first round of the tournament.Since he was 45 minutes late for the game he missed the announcement of forfeit conditions.

As a postscript,there is another twist to the plot. Flude was a last minute entry for the event. That is, it is even possible that Beattie may not have even been aware that he was paired against Flude for the event.

I think the organisers ought to be congratulated for getting this decision right. A replay of the game seemed the fairest route. However, the reserves tournament seems to be suffering from a lack of information for the event. There appears to be a general feeling amongst the reserves players that they are not being treated with enough dignity.

cheers,

**Comeback Kid** · 10-28-2009, 01:36 PM

Originally Posted by gbekker

Round 6 Championship games:

What a great effort by Hacche against Grandmaster Johansen!

I particularly liked 15.) Bxe4 where I thought white had a slight edge. Even though David lost, I enjoyed this game thoroughly.

Thanks Gary for putting up the games.

**Il cavaliere inesistente** · 10-28-2009, 01:58 PM

The dignity of this tournament would be much enhanced if the players abided by the rules judging by some of the goings on.
Beatty does not understand the FIDE forfeiture rules.
Ivanov does not know the triple repetition rule
Firegoat:
The forfeiture rule has been in force for over 3 months and should be familiar to even the meanest of intellect
If the time is not stated forfeit time is zero as mr. Gletsos has pointed out to you.
The forfeit under the rules is not negotiable. It does not have to be claimed
Flude was disadvantaged as he turned up on time, waited for his opponent and then had to play 2 weeks later trying to regain the point

**Firegoat7** · 10-29-2009, 12:26 AM

Originally Posted by Il cavaliere inesistente

The dignity of this tournament would be much enhanced if the players abided by the rules judging by some of the goings on.

There is an 82% chance that you are a Bonham hydra!

cheers,

**Il cavaliere inesistente** · 10-29-2009, 06:21 AM

Originally Posted by Firegoat7

There is an 82% chance that you are a Bonham hydra!

Firegoat I am sure you can do better than that.
I am a Victorian
I am familiar with the rules of chess
I am aware of Beattie's appalling record as a postponer or forfeiter of games.
The questions I posed in my previous post remain unanswered.
Beattie was fortunate in his appeals committee
Flude was disadvantaged through no fault of his own

**Firegoat7** · 10-29-2009, 09:53 AM

Originally Posted by Il cavaliere inesistente

Firegoat I am sure you can do better than that.

I jest, but as a watercolor painter, do you consider tone important?

Originally Posted by Il cavaliere inesistente

I am aware of Beattie's appalling record as a postponer or forfeiter of games.

Never been an issue at MCC.

Originally Posted by Il cavaliere inesistente

Beattie was fortunate in his appeals committee

Agreed. There are a couple of other considerations.
1) The tournament is a round robin
2) Flude was an extremely late entrant
3) Player numbers for the event were poor.
4) A player withdrawal would almost have wrecked the tournament

Originally Posted by Il cavaliere inesistente

Flude was disadvantaged through no fault of his own

In the standing of the tournament, yes of course. From a chessplaying perspective, no he wasn't.

cheers,

10-23-2009, 08:35 AM	#151 (permalink)
MOZ Figurehead absolute. Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Ozchess is the marginalised cyber-spot where cc-Mods choose to engage with cc-banned posters. Posts: 2,637	Wow. Some surprises in that collection. Code: Below are round 5 results Johansen-Pyke 1-0 Lindberg-Morris 1-0 Hamilton-Lee 1-0 Kildisas-Hacche 1-0 Dragicevic-Levi 0-1 Rujevic-Sandler draw After 5 rounds 1-2 Johansen and Levi 4,5 points 3. Morris 3 points 4-8 Hamilton,Dragicevic,Lee,Pyke,Sandler 2,5 points each 9.Lindberg 2 points 10 Rujevic 1,5 11-12 Kildisas and Hacche 1 point each __________________ FReedom though Fischer-Random chess to enjoy the whole game.

10-23-2009, 07:41 PM	#155 (permalink)
Firegoat7 Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: somewhere in virtual reality Posts: 1,217 ICC Handle: guest	Hi, Anyone got a contact number for Gary Bekker? One of the Wijesuriya's asked for a adjournement and I am not 100% sure whether I should turn up tommorrow? cheers, __________________ "...The White Man knows how to make everything, he does not know how to distribute it" Sitting Bull

10-24-2009, 08:17 PM	#156 (permalink)
MOZ Figurehead absolute. Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Ozchess is the marginalised cyber-spot where cc-Mods choose to engage with cc-banned posters. Posts: 2,637	Below are results from round 6 Hacche-Johansen 0-1 Levi-Kildisas draw Lindberg-Hamilton 1-0 Sandler-Dragicevic 1-0 Lee-Rujevic draw Morris-Pyke draw After 6 rounds 1.Johansen 5,5 points 2.Levi 5 3-4 Morris ,Sandler 3,5 each 5-7 Lindberg,Pyke,Lee 3 each 8-9 Hamilton,Dragicevic 2,5 each 10 Rujevic 2 11.Kildisas 1,5 12.Hacche 1 __________________ FReedom though Fischer-Random chess to enjoy the whole game.

10-28-2009, 09:20 AM	#158 (permalink)
Il cavaliere inesistente Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2008 Posts: 189	Round 7 results The round 7 championship results and cross table are now available on CV web site. Follow the link: 09 Results

10-28-2009, 09:39 AM	#159 (permalink)
Il cavaliere inesistente Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2008 Posts: 189	Miscarriage of Justice? In the first round game in the reserves Flude - Beattie, Beattie arrives 45 minutes late and forfeits under the FIDE forfeit time rules. He appeals, wins the appeal and wins the game. How can one win an appeal against a seemingly clear transgression of the rules? No reasons are published.

10-28-2009, 10:14 AM	#160 (permalink)
Firegoat7 Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: somewhere in virtual reality Posts: 1,217 ICC Handle: guest	Originally Posted by Il cavaliere inesistente In the first round game in the reserves Flude - Beattie, Beattie arrives 45 minutes late and forfeits under the FIDE forfeit time rules. Hi Il cavaliere inesistente, Fide rule 6.6a states a. Any player who arrives at the chessboard after the start of the session shall lose the game. Thus the default time is 0 minutes. The rules of a competition may specify otherwise. So under the rules the default time is 0 minutes. However, tournament organisers can set a default time for an event. This was set at 30 minutes for the Victorian reserves. Originally Posted by Il cavaliere inesistente He appeals, wins the appeal and wins the game. How can one win an appeal against a seemingly clear transgression of the rules? No reasons are published. Beattie appealed because previous Victorian chess events, like last years reserves tournament, had a standard default time of 1 hour. There is some suggestion that the new default time was not advertised in advance for this tournament. Therefore Beattie argued that there was no way he could have known the new default time in advance. Given that it was the first round of the tournament.Since he was 45 minutes late for the game he missed the announcement of forfeit conditions. As a postscript,there is another twist to the plot. Flude was a last minute entry for the event. That is, it is even possible that Beattie may not have even been aware that he was paired against Flude for the event. I think the organisers ought to be congratulated for getting this decision right. A replay of the game seemed the fairest route. However, the reserves tournament seems to be suffering from a lack of information for the event. There appears to be a general feeling amongst the reserves players that they are not being treated with enough dignity. cheers, __________________ "...The White Man knows how to make everything, he does not know how to distribute it" Sitting Bull

10-28-2009, 01:36 PM	#161 (permalink)
Comeback Kid Tin Cup Champ 2004 Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Brisbane, Australia Posts: 4,712 ICC Handle: Advantage FICS Handle: Advantage	Great Effort Originally Posted by gbekker Round 6 Championship games: What a great effort by Hacche against Grandmaster Johansen! I particularly liked 15.) Bxe4 where I thought white had a slight edge. Even though David lost, I enjoyed this game thoroughly. Thanks Gary for putting up the games. __________________ . "He was a man, take him for all in all. I shall not look upon his like again." ~ Hamlet ~

10-28-2009, 01:58 PM	#162 (permalink)
Il cavaliere inesistente Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2008 Posts: 189	dignity whose dignity The dignity of this tournament would be much enhanced if the players abided by the rules judging by some of the goings on. Beatty does not understand the FIDE forfeiture rules. Ivanov does not know the triple repetition rule Firegoat: The forfeiture rule has been in force for over 3 months and should be familiar to even the meanest of intellect If the time is not stated forfeit time is zero as mr. Gletsos has pointed out to you. The forfeit under the rules is not negotiable. It does not have to be claimed Flude was disadvantaged as he turned up on time, waited for his opponent and then had to play 2 weeks later trying to regain the point

10-29-2009, 12:26 AM	#163 (permalink)
Firegoat7 Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: somewhere in virtual reality Posts: 1,217 ICC Handle: guest	Originally Posted by Il cavaliere inesistente The dignity of this tournament would be much enhanced if the players abided by the rules judging by some of the goings on. There is an 82% chance that you are a Bonham hydra! cheers, __________________ "...The White Man knows how to make everything, he does not know how to distribute it" Sitting Bull

10-29-2009, 06:21 AM	#164 (permalink)
Il cavaliere inesistente Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2008 Posts: 189	How did Bonham get into this Originally Posted by Firegoat7 There is an 82% chance that you are a Bonham hydra! Firegoat I am sure you can do better than that. I am a Victorian I am familiar with the rules of chess I am aware of Beattie's appalling record as a postponer or forfeiter of games. The questions I posed in my previous post remain unanswered. Beattie was fortunate in his appeals committee Flude was disadvantaged through no fault of his own

10-29-2009, 09:53 AM	#165 (permalink)
Firegoat7 Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: somewhere in virtual reality Posts: 1,217 ICC Handle: guest	Originally Posted by Il cavaliere inesistente Firegoat I am sure you can do better than that. I jest, but as a watercolor painter, do you consider tone important? Originally Posted by Il cavaliere inesistente I am aware of Beattie's appalling record as a postponer or forfeiter of games. Never been an issue at MCC. Originally Posted by Il cavaliere inesistente Beattie was fortunate in his appeals committee Agreed. There are a couple of other considerations. 1) The tournament is a round robin 2) Flude was an extremely late entrant 3) Player numbers for the event were poor. 4) A player withdrawal would almost have wrecked the tournament Originally Posted by Il cavaliere inesistente Flude was disadvantaged through no fault of his own In the standing of the tournament, yes of course. From a chessplaying perspective, no he wasn't. cheers, __________________ "...The White Man knows how to make everything, he does not know how to distribute it" Sitting Bull

LinkBacks (?) LinkBack to this Thread: http://www.ozchess.com.au/chess-tournaments-australia/1172-2009-victorian-championships.html
Posted By	For	Type	Date
Chess Rules	This thread	Refback	10-14-2009 10:47 PM

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Email this Page
Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread: