Go Back   OzChess - Australia's Chess Forum > Australian Chess and General Chess Topics > Chess Rules & Regulations

View Poll Results: Should Elwood Bendigo have been allowed to play round one?
Yes! 4 66.67%
No! 1 16.67%
Unsure / No Answer 1 16.67%
Voters: 6. You may not vote on this poll

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Rating: Thread Rating: 1 votes, 5.00 average.
Old 03-26-2008, 08:12 PM   #1 (permalink)
Tin Cup Champ 2004
 
Comeback Kid's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Brisbane, Australia
Posts: 4,748
ICC Handle: Advantage
FICS Handle: Advantage
Thumbs down Hobson Bay Chess Club

Originally Posted by Elwood Bendigo
Last week I received a email from the HBCC and in it was a calendar. Having not played since the Elwood bendigo tournament in Nov I was excited to play.

I live around the corner in Spotswood, so it was a short drive to the club for the first round of the Purdy cup.

I arrived about half an hour before the start of play, and played a couple of games of blitz before hand- it was good to see some friends and have a chat-
I was asked if I intended to play and of course I said yes-

They started the pairing, and the DP asked what my ranking was and they duly started the pairing( I was still playing blitz at the time)They then proceeded to call out the pairings-I thought I must of missed my name and I was right-the Dp said that I was not in the draw because "I had turned up late"-

He explained that they had a week prior arranged the numbers and it was odd number if I was included- I argued that

a) I was not late- but what he said that was because I had not turned up a week prior when they had taken the first entries and that because there was an odd number no- I was- I asked weather it was stated that entried needed to be in prior to the start date - the answer was no, but I had missedout becaue there was an odd number and that I had a point bye-

b) That I was not the lowest ranked player by a long shot and therefore I should not receive a bye

c) I asked weather this was a closed tournament to HBCC members and the answer was "no" so why were there certain exclusionary conditions in place. And all the DP saidwasthat he was acting under instruction of the president

d) That I took the email of the calendar as invitation to both members and non members- I was told in response that I was late because I had not turned up a week prior ( the calendar said " no chess" - a social night) when the entries were considered - there was no email once this had occurred to the effect- therefore not protecting players from turning up and wasting there time

At the same time that I was arguing my case the treasurer said" but you’re not even a member" - I referred back to point

The DP said he would love me to play but had been guided by the president - who did not offer any comment but that of" shush" - disappointing to say the least.

Don’t get me wrong I have played many tournaments at the HBCC AND THOUROUGHLY ENJOYED THEM_ but this set of circumstances was a let down_

The DP told me that I was in the draw for next week-

I was also a disappointed that they knew the situation earlier and called out the draw- surely the decent thing to do was to let me know prior

My question to you is

i) is this a normal situation

ii) Should a say Guy West or some other highly ranked player turned up would they have been treated any differently

iii)should have the draw been done and ranking consideration BEEN APPLIED?

Hi Elwood

If I may offer my two cents worth here.

Firstly, in relation to your first question I would say what happened to you is rather uncommon. It may be the case that they simply don't like you. Garvin Gray once tried to give me a half point bye for round one because I was 5-10 minutes late, despite the fact I had pre-registered and pre-paid and was the first seed. This was because he doesn't like me, but when experienced Arbiter Ian Murray explained the rules to Garvin I received a full point bye.

But back to your case, I'd look at whether the DP has a grudge. If not, and everyone else had pre-registered a week in advance, its a little unfair to the lowest rated seed that he gets bumped to a bye because someone higher rated than him registered on the day. So in all fairness to you, I think the outcome was correct, but you should have been allowed to take a full point bye for round one.

As for your second question, it involves speculation, but probably the same outcome would have eventuated.

In answer to your third question, more information is needed because the question is a bit unclear.

Sorry I couldn't tell you what you wanted to hear mate. I do hope you don't hold it against me or the club.

Best

AO
__________________
.
"He was a man, take him for all in all. I shall not look upon his like again."

~ Hamlet ~
Comeback Kid is online now  

Users Flag!
Reply With Quote
Old 03-27-2008, 02:25 AM   #2 (permalink)
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 130
Default

Originally Posted by Arrogant-One View Post



As for your second question, it involves speculation, but probably the same outcome would have eventuated.

AO
Never any 2300+ player would get a better treatment from the organizers...and thats what makes this situation more disappointing
MichaelBaron is offline  

Reply With Quote
Old 03-27-2008, 09:32 AM   #3 (permalink)
Member
 
WhiteElephant's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 97
Default

Originally Posted by Arrogant-One View Post

Hi Elwood

If I may offer my two cents worth here.

Firstly, in relation to your first question I would say what happened to you is rather uncommon. It may be the case that they simply don't like you. Garvin Gray once tried to give me a half point bye for round one because I was 5-10 minutes late, despite the fact I had pre-registered and pre-paid and was the first seed. This was because he doesn't like me, but when experienced Arbiter Ian Murray explained the rules to Garvin I received a full point bye.

But back to your case, I'd look at whether the DP has a grudge. If not, and everyone else had pre-registered a week in advance, its a little unfair to the lowest rated seed that he gets bumped to a bye because someone higher rated than him registered on the day. So in all fairness to you, I think the outcome was correct, but you should have been allowed to take a full point bye for round one.

As for your second question, it involves speculation, but probably the same outcome would have eventuated.

In answer to your third question, more information is needed because the question is a bit unclear.

Sorry I couldn't tell you what you wanted to hear mate. I do hope you don't hold it against me or the club.

Best

AO
AO,

Didn't EB say that he did get a full point bye in round 1?

On the possibility of someone at the club having a grudge against EB - you probably haven't met EB personally but I would say that he is someone who would be one of the unlikeliest people in the chess community to have someone hold a grudge against him. He is normal, well presented, has a job etc, unlike many chessplayers.

So this treatment (not the decision itself but the uncaring attitude of the club officials) seems very mysterious.
WhiteElephant is offline  

Reply With Quote
Old 03-29-2008, 04:49 PM   #4 (permalink)
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 130
Default

Check this out..i feel it is relevant

http://chesschat.org/showthread.php?p=189186#post189186
MichaelBaron is offline  

Reply With Quote
Old 03-30-2008, 01:20 PM   #5 (permalink)
Tin Cup Champ 2004
 
Comeback Kid's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Brisbane, Australia
Posts: 4,748
ICC Handle: Advantage
FICS Handle: Advantage
Default GM Short Draw Policy

Originally Posted by Michael Baron
Denying GMs a quick draw, or changing a last round draw or giving a bye to someone other than lowest rated player ( i have given a longer list of example in the Hobson's Bay thread) makes organizer/arbiter feel he is more important as a person.
I agree.
Originally Posted by Michael Baron
Such organisers can be compared to ticket inspectors or parking officers who feel important (even though they are mostly poorly educated and "nobodies" when not wearing uniform).
I disagree. Parking inspectors are not uneducated nobodies, they are civil servants doing a legitmate public service.
Originally Posted by Michael Baron
Similarly, I guess it possibly feels nice for some club-level player to show that he has authority over GMs. What such organisers arbiters do not realise is that through their peasant-like attitude to chess they

a.) influence natural outcomes of the chess tournaments

b.) show their complete ignorance of the chess culture.
How? Antic, as a Grandmaster, should have known the rule. Antic lost the game because he was outplayed, and he therefore has no reason to complain at all.
Originally Posted by Michael Baron
if i wanted to be a chess player i would not come to Australia - I have been here for my work, studies, better life etc. but certainly not for chess.
Until chess is publicly funded there are several other countries more attractive to chess professionals. But even so, Grandmasters Schmaltz and Antic are both hoping to make Australia their permanent homes. Do they know something that Michael does not?
Originally Posted by Michael Baron
In the past, I have been upset due to some events happening in the chess community. I guess it was my mistake. I should just "take it easy" (and taking things easy is in the true spirit of Australia) and play chess for leisure without having any expectations of chess organisers/administrators being professional. Dejan's problem is similar. He is yet to realise that he is no longer in Serbia or any other European country for this matter where chess culture usually prevails over ignorance.
Well, I have never met any arbiter or DOP in Australia who has a weaker knowledge of the rules of chess than Garvin Gray in Queensland. So as long as you stay put in Victoria, you'll actually be receiving better arbitrating on average than you would if you lived elsewhere in Australia.
__________________
.
"He was a man, take him for all in all. I shall not look upon his like again."

~ Hamlet ~
Comeback Kid is online now  

Users Flag!
Reply With Quote
Old 07-16-2010, 03:03 PM   #6 (permalink)
Talkerbot
 
Talkerbot's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 14
Default

I have read your information about Hobson Bay Chess Club.Its a very nice club.A chess club is a great place to go to play chess with other local enthusiasts.I'd look at whether the DP has a grudge.
__________________

-
I am your humble servant!
I am programmed to make posts on OzChess.
I wish only to serve my organic masters.
Talkerbot is offline  

Users Flag!
Reply With Quote
Reply



Thread Tools
Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:



All times are GMT +11. The time now is 10:33 AM.

Powered by vBulletin Copyright © 2000-2010 Jelsoft Enterprises Limited.

The views and opinions expressed in posts on this site are exclusively those of the member who made them, and do not represent the views or opinions of OzChess or OzChess's owners. OzChess does not endorse any post, and makes no representations about the truth or accuracy of any matter contained in any post made by members of this site.