Australian Junior Chess League - Page 2 - OzChess

**Noddy** · 09-02-2008, 01:54 PM

Originally Posted by Iconoclast

Can you tell us why progress toward the ACF handing over Junior matters to the AustJCL has not been reported in the ACF Newsletter?

Iconoclast, please see my post above.

09-03-2008, 01:19 AM

Originally Posted by Iconoclast

I am ignoring this divisional trolling.

Once again, if you accuse me of trolling when I am not you should not expect me to take much interest in your thread except for pointing out your shoddy tactics.

From this, I understand that if someone other than me asks, some where other than here, then you will answer. Is this true?

Depends on who they are, where they ask and how they ask. If I suspect you've put them up to it for a moment I'll react as if you'd asked it.

Am I correct to understand that demonstration of "good faith" by me removing my posts from this thread would be enough for you to deign to answer the question.

No; you would need to indicate clearly that you believed your comments were out of order, as well as just removing them.

I am I right to assume that you will only answer the question when you are inclined to do so?

Yes.

That you would be inclined to do so if:
1. The asker was not me.
2. The question was posed elsewhere.

Already addressed.

3. My posts on this thread where censored.

Probably the best thing for it is for all parties to agree this thread is out of order and not a remotely useful way to encourage me to answer the question, that this whole thread be deleted, and for you to then start again without all the rancour, bile and silly stuff.

PS Noddy's speculation re the reason is not correct.

**Iconoclast** · 09-03-2008, 04:42 PM

Originally Posted by Ophiuchus

Once again, if you accuse me of trolling when I am not you should not expect me to take much interest in your thread except for pointing out your shoddy tactics.

Depends on who they are, where they ask and how they ask. If I suspect you've put them up to it for a moment I'll react as if you'd asked it.

No; you would need to indicate clearly that you believed your comments were out of order, as well as just removing them.

Yes.

Already addressed.

Probably the best thing for it is for all parties to agree this thread is out of order and not a remotely useful way to encourage me to answer the question, that this whole thread be deleted, and for you to then start again without all the rancour, bile and silly stuff.

PS Noddy's speculation re the reason is not correct.

You have made it completely clear that:
1. You do not wish to answer the question - an important and reasonably put question to a high official in the ACF.
2. You will find any excuse not to answer the question. Excuses such as: who asked it; where it was asked; and even, that you will only do so if so inclined.

The general reader may wish to reflect on how your behaviour reflects on the ACF. You may also wish to reflect upon it.

09-03-2008, 05:21 PM

Originally Posted by Iconoclast

You have made it completely clear that:
1. You do not wish to answer the question - an important and reasonably put question to a high official in the ACF.

It was not "reasonably put" but was put as part of a thread set up to troll the ACF with the usual Sweeney abuse.

2. You will find any excuse not to answer the question. Excuses such as: who asked it; where it was asked; and even, that you will only do so if so inclined.

That I will only do so if inclined is quite obviously a tautology, which is why I answered "yes" to it with a smiley.

Concerning the rest, feel free to find out by removing my "excuses", ie by agreeing that your posts on this thread are out of order, false and should be removed.

The general reader may wish to reflect on how your behaviour reflects on the ACF. You may also wish to reflect upon it.

If the "general reader" is even capable of reflecting they will see that this place cannot be taken seriously until it cleans up its act, and nor can you, and nor can anyone who thinks that either should be.

**Iconoclast** · 09-03-2008, 06:18 PM

Originally Posted by Ophiuchus

If the "general reader" is even capable of reflecting they will see that this place cannot be taken seriously until it cleans up its act, and nor can you, and nor can anyone who thinks that either should be.

You have made it completely clear that you are more interested in the status of this bulletin board and the people on it than in answering a legitamate and important question.

I reiterate that the general reader may wish to reflect on how your behaviour reflects on the ACF.

**Dragon-Fly** · 09-03-2008, 07:43 PM

Originally Posted by Iconoclast

The unfair junior team levy is a typical example of how moribund the ACF is. I would like to know what the AJCL has to say about this dispute. Is the AJCL dead in the water? The ACF never mentions the AJCL in its Newsletter. Perhaps it really is as dead as I have (very recently) heard it was. That would be a tragedy. I know Jenny Oliver was going to murder anyone who successfully scuttled the AJCL. I might run a book on who's funeral will be the first we hear about. The betting will start at:

Gary Wastell 2:1
George Howard 2:1
Richard Gastineau-Hills 3:1
Bill Gletsos 3:1
Kevin Bonham 4:1
Leonid Sandler 4:1
Brian Thomas 4:1
Haydn Barber 10:1
Graham Richards 10:1
Denis Jessop 50:1
Mos Ali 100:1

I am on your list and I haven't heard anything about it, and not a great deal about the AJCL either.

**Iconoclast** · 09-03-2008, 08:43 PM

Originally Posted by Dragon-Fly

I am on your list and I haven't heard anything about it, and not a great deal about the AJCL either.

WOW. that is funny! PM me so I know who's odds I should lengthen. And then you should try to find out about the AJCL.

The AJCL should, I hope, turn out pretty well, but I am sure that some in the ACF are unhappy that the AJCL can develop the capacity to eclipse the ACF. At the moment the ACF is doing its best to make sure the ACJL cannot become more important than the ACF. You need only look at how cagey Kevin Bonham is about talking about the AJCL, to see how delicate the situation is.

09-03-2008, 08:57 PM

Originally Posted by Iconoclast

You have made it completely clear that you are more interested in the status of this bulletin board and the people on it than in answering a legitamate and important question.

No I haven't, as any person with a legitimate interest in the issue who asked me the question in a reasonable manner and appropriate place would find out.

I just have no interest in responding to it when it is just another item of your trolling.

I reiterate that the general reader may wish to reflect on how your behaviour reflects on the ACF.

Reiterate your nonsense all you like; I have already disposed of it.

You need only look at how cagey Kevin Bonham is about talking about the AJCL, to see how delicate the situation is.

There is nothing delicate about the situation that I am aware of.

**Iconoclast** · 09-03-2008, 09:19 PM

Originally Posted by Ophiuchus

No I haven't, as any person with a legitimate interest in the issue who asked me the question in a reasonable manner and appropriate place would find out.

You are making this a PERSONAL issue all about you, when it is a NATIONAL issue in chess.

You are putting your PERSONAL issues ahead of your DUTY as an ACF official to keep Australian chess informed of the power transfer to the AJCL.

For the third time, people here may assess your behaviour here and how it reflects on the ACF.

I will try again. Can you tell us why progress toward the ACF handing over Junior matters to the AJCL has not been reported in the ACF Newsletter?

09-03-2008, 10:38 PM

Originally Posted by Iconoclast

You are making this a PERSONAL issue all about you, when it is a NATIONAL issue in chess.

Actually your trolling about it just represents your personal issues with a great number of people involved in the current ACF. If your concern was with a reasonable question about a national issue rather than personal trolling you could have raised it all more reasonably instead of starting a thread to troll the ACF about the AJCL.

You are putting your PERSONAL issues ahead of your DUTY as an ACF official to keep Australian chess informed of the power transfer to the AJCL.

I have no such duty relating to the AusJCL by virtue of any position I hold, and nor do I have any duty to post anything here.

For the third time, people here may assess your behaviour here and how it reflects on the ACF.

And for the third time, if they have the slightest clue they will draw the same conclusion that it doesn't. Now, any chance of you snapping out of spambot mode on this? It never works, after all.

I will try again. Can you tell us why progress toward the ACF handing over Junior matters to the AJCL has not been reported in the ACF Newsletter?

Yes I can but I am not inclined to because of your poor attitude on this thread.

**Just2Good** · 09-04-2008, 01:28 PM

Originally Posted by Ophiuchus

No I haven't, as any person with a legitimate interest in the issue who asked me the question in a reasonable manner and appropriate place would find out.

Kevin,

I asked you the question in a very polite and courteous fashion, and you still refused to answer. I know this is a sensitive issue for the ACF, especially after shaking Libby down for a couple grand, but your stated rational for not answering a very simple and innocuous question is just ridiculous. Just cop a bit of accountability for a change and provide an honest answer to a straight forward query.

Best Regards,

AO

**Iconoclast** · 09-04-2008, 10:33 PM

Originally Posted by Ophiuchus

Yes I can [answer the question] but I am not inclined to because of your poor attitude on this thread.

And with these words you have condemed yourself. Be honest and true. You have no interest in answering the question. You have placed a catch-all condition that you can invoke at will - to wit: my "poor attitude."

You, as do others, know and can the answer why the ACF is not talking about the AJCL. You simply do not have within you, the particular personal qualities to do so. Feel free speculate here, as to what those qualities they may be.

Nevertheless, I will try again. Can you tell us why progress toward the ACF handing over Junior matters to the AJCL has not been reported in the ACF Newsletter?

09-05-2008, 07:32 PM

Originally Posted by Iconoclast

And with these words you have condemed yourself.

To another post of your empty trolling? Sheesh, how devastating.

Be honest and true. You have no interest in answering the question.

I'll answer it if my conditions are met, but I have to admit that answering it would be a remarkably dull experience for me and an even duller one for the reader.

You have placed a catch-all condition that you can invoke at will

But I have also limited the ways I will invoke it. If my conditions are met you will have your answer.

You, as do others, know and can the answer why the ACF is not talking about the AJCL. You simply do not have within you, the particular personal qualities to do so. Feel free speculate here, as to what those qualities they may be.

Naaah, I'd have to spend too many seconds of my life trying to successfully parse your first sentence.

*repeat of question ignored, you're wasting bandwidth*

Originally Posted by Arrogant-One

I asked you the question in a very polite and courteous fashion, and you still refused to answer.

Oh diddums. Need a handkerchief, or do you prefer tissues?

I know this is a sensitive issue for the ACF, especially after shaking Libby down for a couple grand, but your stated rational for not answering a very simple and innocuous question is just ridiculous.

There is nothing sensitive or even interesting about either the question Iconoclast asked or its answer. I just choose not to give that answer on a thread devoted to more silly trolling. Perhaps in time people will learn that if they want to know these things they need to take a better approach to such issues.

Just cop a bit of accountability for a change and provide an honest answer to a straight forward query.

I'm accountable to the National Conference that determines my position, not to you. If you've got an issue with my performance, feel free to pressure your State Association to run or support someone else.

**Iconoclast** · 09-06-2008, 01:11 AM

Tell us all why the advent of the AJCL has not been followed in the ACF Newsletter?

**Iconoclast** · 09-20-2008, 02:45 PM

The squeaky wheel gets the oil: Here I post the as yet unpublished article about the AJCL that might go into the next ACF Newsletter. (No thanks to Kevin Bonham ACF Vice President.)

A NEW ERA FOR AUSTRALIAN JUNIOR CHESS

Readers may be aware that recently an Australian junior chess league called AusJCL was formed. It is the culmination of an initiative by Jenni Oliver begun some while ago. The aim is for it to administer junior chess at the national level by performing most of the junior chess functions currently with the ACF.

A short time ago the AusJCL applied to the ACF for recognition as an Associated Body representing junior chess at the national level and for authority to administer junior chess on behalf of the ACF.

On 17 September 2008 the ACF Council decided, in an e-mail vote, to approve both those things with effect from 1 November 2008. At the same time it appointed Denis Jessop as the ACF Liaison Officer with the AusJCL. The new arrangements will not affect decisions already taken by the ACF so that they have no application to the upcoming Australian Schools Teams Championships finals and the Australian Junior Championships both to be held in Adelaide under the auspices of the SACA and the SAJCL.

I moved the motions in the Council and they were seconded by Richard Gastineau-Hills. Each of us has been a strong supporter of the AusJCL concept. In moving the motions I pointed out that this development is the most significant made for the administration of chess in Australia at the national level since the formation of the Australian Chess Federation in 1922. Except for some organisational changes, the ACF is still structured much as it was when first formed.

The basis of the junior chess league concept, which has already been successful in some States and Territories, is that junior chess administration has some aspects that differ markedly from open chess. Moreover, junior chess leagues attract many administrators who would not otherwise be involved. I see it as an undoubted benefit for Australian chess generally for there to be a successful Australian junior chess league. It will benefit junior chess by the presence of experts in that field. It will benefit the ACF as its officers will be able to devote more time to administration of chess generally.

The current arrangements are seen as transitional in that the AusJCL has not yet begun its formal operations and it needs time to settle into things. Also there are some details of procedure to be worked out between the ACF and the AusJCL. I expect these to be addressed in the coming months.

Meanwhile I look forward to the success of the new development with confidence.

Denis Jessop
ACF/AusJCL Liaison Officer

The Following is an as yet unpublished response from the AJCL

The interim AusJCL council is extremely gratified that the ACF has recognized the benefit to Australian Junior chess that a National Junior organization will bring.

The interim council consists of

President IA Charles Zworestine
Vice-President GM Ian Rogers
Treasurer Tania Simmonds
Secretary Tracy Gray
Junior Development Co-ordinator Kerry Lyall
Events Co-ordinator Jenni Oliver
Selections Administrator Shannon Oliver
General Council positions WGM Daniela Nutu-Gajic
Celine Derwent

Initially the work of the council will be to create better rules and procedures and information for tasks such as the overseas junior events and Ergas. Work is almost completed on the first task, which is the overseas junior events and a document will be available for public comment. In future before juniors apply for selection for overseas events they will have much better information as to how these run and what is expected of them and of parents.

The next big task that is planned is a reassessment of the Australian Juniors. A survey will shortly be released to gather information and if a new model is necessary it is hoped to be in place for Aus Juniors 2011.

The first AGM will be held in Adelaide in January 2009 at the Aus Juniors and the council will be elected for the next year.

This is an exciting concept and will need the ideas and support of all of those with an interest in Junior chess.

It is not meant to supplant the valuable work being done by State organizations, but to bring order and cohesion to what is happening at the national level with the long term aim of growing participation at the grass roots level as well as increasing the number of elite players. It will also work to improve the migration paths from junior to adult chess.

Jenni Oliver
AusJCL Events coordinator”

09-02-2008, 01:54 PM	#16 (permalink)
Noddy Senior Member Join Date: May 2008 Location: Toyland Posts: 255	Originally Posted by Iconoclast Can you tell us why progress toward the ACF handing over Junior matters to the AustJCL has not been reported in the ACF Newsletter? Iconoclast, please see my post above.

09-03-2008, 01:19 AM	#17 (permalink)
Ophiuchus Posts: n/a	Originally Posted by Iconoclast I am ignoring this divisional trolling. Once again, if you accuse me of trolling when I am not you should not expect me to take much interest in your thread except for pointing out your shoddy tactics. From this, I understand that if someone other than me asks, some where other than here, then you will answer. Is this true? Depends on who they are, where they ask and how they ask. If I suspect you've put them up to it for a moment I'll react as if you'd asked it. Am I correct to understand that demonstration of "good faith" by me removing my posts from this thread would be enough for you to deign to answer the question. No; you would need to indicate clearly that you believed your comments were out of order, as well as just removing them. I am I right to assume that you will only answer the question when you are inclined to do so? Yes. That you would be inclined to do so if: 1. The asker was not me. 2. The question was posed elsewhere. Already addressed. 3. My posts on this thread where censored. Probably the best thing for it is for all parties to agree this thread is out of order and not a remotely useful way to encourage me to answer the question, that this whole thread be deleted, and for you to then start again without all the rancour, bile and silly stuff. PS Noddy's speculation re the reason is not correct.

09-03-2008, 04:42 PM	#18 (permalink)
Iconoclast Immoderator Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Wollongong NSW Posts: 2,302	Originally Posted by Ophiuchus Once again, if you accuse me of trolling when I am not you should not expect me to take much interest in your thread except for pointing out your shoddy tactics. Depends on who they are, where they ask and how they ask. If I suspect you've put them up to it for a moment I'll react as if you'd asked it. No; you would need to indicate clearly that you believed your comments were out of order, as well as just removing them. Yes. Already addressed. Probably the best thing for it is for all parties to agree this thread is out of order and not a remotely useful way to encourage me to answer the question, that this whole thread be deleted, and for you to then start again without all the rancour, bile and silly stuff. PS Noddy's speculation re the reason is not correct. You have made it completely clear that: 1. You do not wish to answer the question - an important and reasonably put question to a high official in the ACF. 2. You will find any excuse not to answer the question. Excuses such as: who asked it; where it was asked; and even, that you will only do so if so inclined. The general reader may wish to reflect on how your behaviour reflects on the ACF. You may also wish to reflect upon it. __________________ The individual is hopeless without the group. The group is hopeless without its individuals.

09-03-2008, 05:21 PM	#19 (permalink)
Ophiuchus Posts: n/a	Originally Posted by Iconoclast You have made it completely clear that: 1. You do not wish to answer the question - an important and reasonably put question to a high official in the ACF. It was not "reasonably put" but was put as part of a thread set up to troll the ACF with the usual Sweeney abuse. 2. You will find any excuse not to answer the question. Excuses such as: who asked it; where it was asked; and even, that you will only do so if so inclined. That I will only do so if inclined is quite obviously a tautology, which is why I answered "yes" to it with a smiley. Concerning the rest, feel free to find out by removing my "excuses", ie by agreeing that your posts on this thread are out of order, false and should be removed. The general reader may wish to reflect on how your behaviour reflects on the ACF. You may also wish to reflect upon it. If the "general reader" is even capable of reflecting they will see that this place cannot be taken seriously until it cleans up its act, and nor can you, and nor can anyone who thinks that either should be.

09-03-2008, 06:18 PM	#20 (permalink)
Iconoclast Immoderator Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Wollongong NSW Posts: 2,302	Originally Posted by Ophiuchus If the "general reader" is even capable of reflecting they will see that this place cannot be taken seriously until it cleans up its act, and nor can you, and nor can anyone who thinks that either should be. You have made it completely clear that you are more interested in the status of this bulletin board and the people on it than in answering a legitamate and important question. I reiterate that the general reader may wish to reflect on how your behaviour reflects on the ACF. __________________ The individual is hopeless without the group. The group is hopeless without its individuals.

09-03-2008, 07:43 PM	#21 (permalink)
Dragon-Fly Red Baron Join Date: Aug 2008 Posts: 69	Originally Posted by Iconoclast The unfair junior team levy is a typical example of how moribund the ACF is. I would like to know what the AJCL has to say about this dispute. Is the AJCL dead in the water? The ACF never mentions the AJCL in its Newsletter. Perhaps it really is as dead as I have (very recently) heard it was. That would be a tragedy. I know Jenny Oliver was going to murder anyone who successfully scuttled the AJCL. I might run a book on who's funeral will be the first we hear about. The betting will start at: Gary Wastell 2:1 George Howard 2:1 Richard Gastineau-Hills 3:1 Bill Gletsos 3:1 Kevin Bonham 4:1 Leonid Sandler 4:1 Brian Thomas 4:1 Haydn Barber 10:1 Graham Richards 10:1 Denis Jessop 50:1 Mos Ali 100:1 I am on your list and I haven't heard anything about it, and not a great deal about the AJCL either.

09-03-2008, 08:43 PM	#22 (permalink)
Iconoclast Immoderator Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Wollongong NSW Posts: 2,302	Originally Posted by Dragon-Fly I am on your list and I haven't heard anything about it, and not a great deal about the AJCL either. WOW. that is funny! PM me so I know who's odds I should lengthen. And then you should try to find out about the AJCL. The AJCL should, I hope, turn out pretty well, but I am sure that some in the ACF are unhappy that the AJCL can develop the capacity to eclipse the ACF. At the moment the ACF is doing its best to make sure the ACJL cannot become more important than the ACF. You need only look at how cagey Kevin Bonham is about talking about the AJCL, to see how delicate the situation is. __________________ The individual is hopeless without the group. The group is hopeless without its individuals.

09-03-2008, 08:57 PM	#23 (permalink)
Ophiuchus Posts: n/a	Originally Posted by Iconoclast You have made it completely clear that you are more interested in the status of this bulletin board and the people on it than in answering a legitamate and important question. No I haven't, as any person with a legitimate interest in the issue who asked me the question in a reasonable manner and appropriate place would find out. I just have no interest in responding to it when it is just another item of your trolling. I reiterate that the general reader may wish to reflect on how your behaviour reflects on the ACF. Reiterate your nonsense all you like; I have already disposed of it. You need only look at how cagey Kevin Bonham is about talking about the AJCL, to see how delicate the situation is. There is nothing delicate about the situation that I am aware of.

09-03-2008, 09:19 PM	#24 (permalink)
Iconoclast Immoderator Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Wollongong NSW Posts: 2,302	Originally Posted by Ophiuchus No I haven't, as any person with a legitimate interest in the issue who asked me the question in a reasonable manner and appropriate place would find out. You are making this a PERSONAL issue all about you, when it is a NATIONAL issue in chess. You are putting your PERSONAL issues ahead of your DUTY as an ACF official to keep Australian chess informed of the power transfer to the AJCL. For the third time, people here may assess your behaviour here and how it reflects on the ACF. I will try again. Can you tell us why progress toward the ACF handing over Junior matters to the AJCL has not been reported in the ACF Newsletter? __________________ The individual is hopeless without the group. The group is hopeless without its individuals.

09-03-2008, 10:38 PM	#25 (permalink)
Ophiuchus Posts: n/a	Originally Posted by Iconoclast You are making this a PERSONAL issue all about you, when it is a NATIONAL issue in chess. Actually your trolling about it just represents your personal issues with a great number of people involved in the current ACF. If your concern was with a reasonable question about a national issue rather than personal trolling you could have raised it all more reasonably instead of starting a thread to troll the ACF about the AJCL. You are putting your PERSONAL issues ahead of your DUTY as an ACF official to keep Australian chess informed of the power transfer to the AJCL. I have no such duty relating to the AusJCL by virtue of any position I hold, and nor do I have any duty to post anything here. For the third time, people here may assess your behaviour here and how it reflects on the ACF. And for the third time, if they have the slightest clue they will draw the same conclusion that it doesn't. Now, any chance of you snapping out of spambot mode on this? It never works, after all. I will try again. Can you tell us why progress toward the ACF handing over Junior matters to the AJCL has not been reported in the ACF Newsletter? Yes I can but I am not inclined to because of your poor attitude on this thread. Last edited by Ophiuchus : 09-04-2008 at 12:25 AM

09-04-2008, 01:28 PM	#26 (permalink)
Just2Good Tin Cup Champ 2004 Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Cairns Posts: 6,056 ICC Handle: Advantage FICS Handle: Advantage	Kevin Bonham's is Tongue Tied Originally Posted by Ophiuchus No I haven't, as any person with a legitimate interest in the issue who asked me the question in a reasonable manner and appropriate place would find out. Kevin, I asked you the question in a very polite and courteous fashion, and you still refused to answer. I know this is a sensitive issue for the ACF, especially after shaking Libby down for a couple grand, but your stated rational for not answering a very simple and innocuous question is just ridiculous. Just cop a bit of accountability for a change and provide an honest answer to a straight forward query. Best Regards, AO __________________ . "You never change things by fighting the existing reality. To change something, build a new model that makes the existing model obsolete." ~ Buckminster Fuller ~

09-04-2008, 10:33 PM	#27 (permalink)
Iconoclast Immoderator Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Wollongong NSW Posts: 2,302	Originally Posted by Ophiuchus Yes I can [answer the question] but I am not inclined to because of your poor attitude on this thread. And with these words you have condemed yourself. Be honest and true. You have no interest in answering the question. You have placed a catch-all condition that you can invoke at will - to wit: my "poor attitude." You, as do others, know and can the answer why the ACF is not talking about the AJCL. You simply do not have within you, the particular personal qualities to do so. Feel free speculate here, as to what those qualities they may be. Nevertheless, I will try again. Can you tell us why progress toward the ACF handing over Junior matters to the AJCL has not been reported in the ACF Newsletter? __________________ The individual is hopeless without the group. The group is hopeless without its individuals.

09-05-2008, 07:32 PM	#28 (permalink)
Ophiuchus Posts: n/a	Originally Posted by Iconoclast And with these words you have condemed yourself. To another post of your empty trolling? Sheesh, how devastating. Be honest and true. You have no interest in answering the question. I'll answer it if my conditions are met, but I have to admit that answering it would be a remarkably dull experience for me and an even duller one for the reader. You have placed a catch-all condition that you can invoke at will But I have also limited the ways I will invoke it. If my conditions are met you will have your answer. You, as do others, know and can the answer why the ACF is not talking about the AJCL. You simply do not have within you, the particular personal qualities to do so. Feel free speculate here, as to what those qualities they may be. Naaah, I'd have to spend too many seconds of my life trying to successfully parse your first sentence. repeat of question ignored, you're wasting bandwidth Originally Posted by Arrogant-One I asked you the question in a very polite and courteous fashion, and you still refused to answer. Oh diddums. Need a handkerchief, or do you prefer tissues? I know this is a sensitive issue for the ACF, especially after shaking Libby down for a couple grand, but your stated rational for not answering a very simple and innocuous question is just ridiculous. There is nothing sensitive or even interesting about either the question Iconoclast asked or its answer. I just choose not to give that answer on a thread devoted to more silly trolling. Perhaps in time people will learn that if they want to know these things they need to take a better approach to such issues. Just cop a bit of accountability for a change and provide an honest answer to a straight forward query. I'm accountable to the National Conference that determines my position, not to you. If you've got an issue with my performance, feel free to pressure your State Association to run or support someone else.

09-06-2008, 01:11 AM	#29 (permalink)
Iconoclast Immoderator Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Wollongong NSW Posts: 2,302	Tell us all why the advent of the AJCL has not been followed in the ACF Newsletter? __________________ The individual is hopeless without the group. The group is hopeless without its individuals.

09-20-2008, 02:45 PM	#30 (permalink)
Iconoclast Immoderator Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Wollongong NSW Posts: 2,302	The squeaky wheel gets the oil: Here I post the as yet unpublished article about the AJCL that might go into the next ACF Newsletter. (No thanks to Kevin Bonham ACF Vice President.) A NEW ERA FOR AUSTRALIAN JUNIOR CHESS Readers may be aware that recently an Australian junior chess league called AusJCL was formed. It is the culmination of an initiative by Jenni Oliver begun some while ago. The aim is for it to administer junior chess at the national level by performing most of the junior chess functions currently with the ACF. A short time ago the AusJCL applied to the ACF for recognition as an Associated Body representing junior chess at the national level and for authority to administer junior chess on behalf of the ACF. On 17 September 2008 the ACF Council decided, in an e-mail vote, to approve both those things with effect from 1 November 2008. At the same time it appointed Denis Jessop as the ACF Liaison Officer with the AusJCL. The new arrangements will not affect decisions already taken by the ACF so that they have no application to the upcoming Australian Schools Teams Championships finals and the Australian Junior Championships both to be held in Adelaide under the auspices of the SACA and the SAJCL. I moved the motions in the Council and they were seconded by Richard Gastineau-Hills. Each of us has been a strong supporter of the AusJCL concept. In moving the motions I pointed out that this development is the most significant made for the administration of chess in Australia at the national level since the formation of the Australian Chess Federation in 1922. Except for some organisational changes, the ACF is still structured much as it was when first formed. The basis of the junior chess league concept, which has already been successful in some States and Territories, is that junior chess administration has some aspects that differ markedly from open chess. Moreover, junior chess leagues attract many administrators who would not otherwise be involved. I see it as an undoubted benefit for Australian chess generally for there to be a successful Australian junior chess league. It will benefit junior chess by the presence of experts in that field. It will benefit the ACF as its officers will be able to devote more time to administration of chess generally. The current arrangements are seen as transitional in that the AusJCL has not yet begun its formal operations and it needs time to settle into things. Also there are some details of procedure to be worked out between the ACF and the AusJCL. I expect these to be addressed in the coming months. Meanwhile I look forward to the success of the new development with confidence. Denis Jessop ACF/AusJCL Liaison Officer The Following is an as yet unpublished response from the AJCL The interim AusJCL council is extremely gratified that the ACF has recognized the benefit to Australian Junior chess that a National Junior organization will bring. The interim council consists of President IA Charles Zworestine Vice-President GM Ian Rogers Treasurer Tania Simmonds Secretary Tracy Gray Junior Development Co-ordinator Kerry Lyall Events Co-ordinator Jenni Oliver Selections Administrator Shannon Oliver General Council positions WGM Daniela Nutu-Gajic Celine Derwent Initially the work of the council will be to create better rules and procedures and information for tasks such as the overseas junior events and Ergas. Work is almost completed on the first task, which is the overseas junior events and a document will be available for public comment. In future before juniors apply for selection for overseas events they will have much better information as to how these run and what is expected of them and of parents. The next big task that is planned is a reassessment of the Australian Juniors. A survey will shortly be released to gather information and if a new model is necessary it is hoped to be in place for Aus Juniors 2011. The first AGM will be held in Adelaide in January 2009 at the Aus Juniors and the council will be elected for the next year. This is an exciting concept and will need the ideas and support of all of those with an interest in Junior chess. It is not meant to supplant the valuable work being done by State organizations, but to bring order and cohesion to what is happening at the national level with the long term aim of growing participation at the grass roots level as well as increasing the number of elite players. It will also work to improve the migration paths from junior to adult chess. Jenni Oliver AusJCL Events coordinator” __________________ The individual is hopeless without the group. The group is hopeless without its individuals.

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