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**Just2Good** · 01-19-2012, 03:59 PM

Originally Posted by Kevin

Incidentally if I can go to the Olympiad for the full event next year it occurs to me that I could double as an olympiad bulletin editor and make sure our donors got more timely and complete coverage of our efforts than in the past.
Cheers, Kevin.

I cannot think of any good reason for the ACF to send anyone apart from the participant players to the Olympiad. The need for an Olympiad Bulletin Editor is not pressing. Believe me, there will be more than enough proper journalists covering the event so that Australians will be kept abreast of happenings there.

I even recall Arianne being reported at this event a few years ago by the Sydney Morning Herald. It would be a gigantic waste of ACF dollars to send someone to do the same job that the SMH is already doing.

**antichrist** · 01-19-2012, 04:31 PM

Originally Posted by Julian Ass

24 FROM: KEVIN BONHAM SENT: TUESDAY, 9 AUGUST 2011 00:27
Subject: Re: Oceania Chess Confederation (OCC) / FIDE Congress

Dear Exec,
I am also keen that we deal with this as soon as we can. A good place to start might be: what concrete reasons do we currently have for not affiliating? It is a while since we first looked at it so I do not remember what particular objections were raised, beyond concern about the statutes being inadequate in various ways.
If we can list any problems we have with affiliating perhaps the OCC can resolve them.
I have investigated the cost of going to the FIDE congress this year and estimate it at about $3400, which is quite expensive compared with the Olympiad years for which accommodation is covered. Aside from keeping an eye on any matters involving the OCC I am not aware of anything likely to affect us to this stage. A decision on whether I go needs to be made by early September.
Incidentally if I can go to the Olympiad for the full event next year it occurs to me that I could double as an olympiad bulletin editor and make sure our donors got more timely and complete coverage of our efforts than in the past.
Cheers, Kevin.

What were the matters involving OCC that our delegate had to keep an eye on?

What reason would the ACF to send a delegate next year?

**antichrist** · 01-20-2012, 11:26 AM

I am not sure if the delegate provided a report or not, I think Brian Jones asked him ?????????????

**Iconoclast** · 01-20-2012, 09:06 PM

After an absence, a cursory squiz at the latest leaks I can confirm that the ACF is as unfunctional as its working parts.

**Just2Good** · 01-21-2012, 02:33 PM

It seems in his wisdom of the ages, Dennis is now wondering why he does the things he does. First he said this:

Originally Posted by Dennis

I wonder why we, or others, even bother with the Toolbpox.

DJ

And then, just days later, he says this:

Originally Posted by Dennis

I read that (OzChess) thread with a reaction like yours [sic] ...

So why does he keep reading here if he wonders why he does it?

**Julian Ass** · 01-25-2012, 08:52 PM

25 FROM: DENIS JESSOP SENT: TUESDAY, 9 AUGUST 2011 14:32
Subject: Re: Oceania Chess Confederation (OCC) / FIDE Congress

Dear Kevin and Colleagues
I recall that one aspect of our concern was the possible financial liability we might incur, being the largest country in the zone. I'm not sure that we need to worry too much about that as we should perhaps be willing to help support development of chess in the smaller Oceania regions and could withdraw from the OCC if we found ourselves victimised. Mind you, to my knowledge, chess is not something in which Melanesians have taken any real interest: cf PNG whose chess players seem to be white men (5 or 6 of them and not all living in PNG) Fiji where the chess players are Indians and Vanuatu where there aren't any (either Indians or chess players) to speak of.
Another matter was the need for the body at all as the Oceania Zone president could do all that was needed. I am inclined to this view and suspect ulterior motives but only because of some of those involved though the motives may be harmless. You never know with FIDE.
As things now stand, the OCC statutes are awful and whether the OCC is lawfully constituted and the statutes properly accepted is not clear. Brian is not one for such niceties as he has made clear on Chess Chat so the real beauty - what is the applicable law if there is a dispute - is not addressed either.
Cheers
Denis

**antichrist** · 01-25-2012, 10:56 PM

you would think that such a dire situation would incentivate the ACF to do some thing about it instead of making excuses as to why not get involved. But I do agree with Denis J's concerns re the correct way to do things before they become messy with fights.

Australia could sponsor chess in schools there, with keen volunteers to carry out.

**antichrist** · 01-28-2012, 02:57 PM

if the crosstable for the 93-4 is missing in ACF, now needed to enable Trevor Tao to apply for norms, could that mean that back in 94 their archivist or ratings officer did not do a proper job - or were lost in transit or flooding or fell off back of truck or the rats ate

**Firegoat7** · 01-28-2012, 10:57 PM

Originally Posted by antichrist

you would think that such a dire situation would incentivate the ACF to do some thing about it instead of making excuses as to why not get involved. But I do agree with Denis J's concerns re the correct way to do things before they become messy with fights.

Australia could sponsor chess in schools there, with keen volunteers to carry out.

I am still waiting for my $190!

**Julian Ass** · 01-31-2012, 10:40 PM

26 FROM: NORMAN GREENWOOD SENT THU, AUG 4, 2011 AT 8:35 PM

Dear Shaun
Many thanks for the reminder.
Please note that payment of the OCC Affiliation Fee has been deferred pending an ACF Council decision thereon.
In my earlier email to you I incorrectly assumed that the ACF had agreed to Affiliate.
Regards
Norman G

**Julian Ass** · 02-10-2012, 04:35 AM

27 FROM: SHAUN PRESS SENT: FRIDAY, 12 AUGUST 2011 11:00
Subject: Re: Oceania Chess Confederation - 2011 Affiliation Fees Invoice

Dear Norm,
I seek clarification on the points raised in your email below. Was it the case that you had received authorisation from the ACF to pay the previous invoice, or that authorisation was never given at the time of your original reply?
If it is simply a matter of proper financial governance, then I assume it will be dealt with promptly.When you say the decision has been deferred, I am unsure of the time frame you are operating in. I believe there was an ACF meeting on the 31st July (ie a few days before your last email arrived). I assume that this topic was on the agenda, if only as part of the treasurers usual request to authorise payments.
Was it discussed at this meeting, but a final decision held over to the next one?The timing of this is important to the Oceania Chess Confederation as we are in the process of allocating Oceania events and funding to member countries.
With thanks
Shaun PressTreasurer, Oceania Chess Confederation

**Julian Ass** · 02-10-2012, 04:36 AM

28 FROM: DENIS JESSOP SENT: FRIDAY, 12 AUGUST 2011 13:15
Subject: Re: Oceania Chess Confederation (OCC) / FIDE Congress

Dear Kevin and Colleagues
Another reason that was put in our letter to Brian was that we were not satisfied that the formation of the OCC had any significant benefits either for the ACF or for the other countries in the Oceania Zone whether yet members of FIDE or not. I'm not sure that we regarded Brian's response as meeting our point or, for that matter, whether we have closely considered that response.
CheersDenis

**antichrist** · 02-10-2012, 11:11 AM

Listen Kevin, Denis and Shaun, if you guys cannot leak any juicy scandal gossip we don't want to know about it. We have enuf bores here already.

**Julian Ass** · 02-12-2012, 05:03 PM

29 FROM: NORMAN GREENWOOD SENT: FRIDAY, 12 AUGUST 2011 15:35
Subject: Re: Oceania Chess Confederation - 2011 Affiliation Fees Invoice

Dear Tom
Whilst payment of the OCC Affiliation Fee is a Treasurer matter can I trouble you to respond to Shaun as you are preparing the Council Minute re OCC matters following decisions thereon at the recently held meeting.
Many thanks
Norman G

**Julian Ass** · 02-14-2012, 06:38 PM

30 FROM: NORMAN GREENWOOD SENT: WEDNESDAY, 17 AUGUST 2011 00:40
Subject: Re: Oceania Chess Confederation - 2011 Affiliation Fees Invoice

Dear Shaun
Whilst payment of invoices are a Treasurer matter it is appropriate the response to your email should be by the ACF Secretary who has the responsibility of minuting ACF decisions relating to the OCC so you will be receiving a response thereon shortly.
Regards
Norman G

01-19-2012, 03:59 PM	#76 (permalink)
Just2Good Tin Cup Champ 2004 Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Cairns Posts: 6,233 ICC Handle: Advantage FICS Handle: Advantage	ACF Should Re-Consider This Idea Originally Posted by Kevin Incidentally if I can go to the Olympiad for the full event next year it occurs to me that I could double as an olympiad bulletin editor and make sure our donors got more timely and complete coverage of our efforts than in the past. Cheers, Kevin. I cannot think of any good reason for the ACF to send anyone apart from the participant players to the Olympiad. The need for an Olympiad Bulletin Editor is not pressing. Believe me, there will be more than enough proper journalists covering the event so that Australians will be kept abreast of happenings there. I even recall Arianne being reported at this event a few years ago by the Sydney Morning Herald. It would be a gigantic waste of ACF dollars to send someone to do the same job that the SMH is already doing. __________________ . "The fox knows many things, but the hedgehog knows one big thing." ~ Isaiah Berlin ~

01-19-2012, 04:31 PM	#77 (permalink)
antichrist Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Byron Bay, NSW Posts: 2,821	Originally Posted by Julian Ass 24 FROM: KEVIN BONHAM SENT: TUESDAY, 9 AUGUST 2011 00:27 Subject: Re: Oceania Chess Confederation (OCC) / FIDE Congress Dear Exec, I am also keen that we deal with this as soon as we can. A good place to start might be: what concrete reasons do we currently have for not affiliating? It is a while since we first looked at it so I do not remember what particular objections were raised, beyond concern about the statutes being inadequate in various ways. If we can list any problems we have with affiliating perhaps the OCC can resolve them. I have investigated the cost of going to the FIDE congress this year and estimate it at about $3400, which is quite expensive compared with the Olympiad years for which accommodation is covered. Aside from keeping an eye on any matters involving the OCC I am not aware of anything likely to affect us to this stage. A decision on whether I go needs to be made by early September. Incidentally if I can go to the Olympiad for the full event next year it occurs to me that I could double as an olympiad bulletin editor and make sure our donors got more timely and complete coverage of our efforts than in the past. Cheers, Kevin. What were the matters involving OCC that our delegate had to keep an eye on? What reason would the ACF to send a delegate next year?

01-20-2012, 09:06 PM	#79 (permalink)
Iconoclast Immoderator Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Wollongong NSW Posts: 2,302	After an absence, a cursory squiz at the latest leaks I can confirm that the ACF is as unfunctional as its working parts. __________________ The individual is hopeless without the group. The group is hopeless without its individuals.

01-21-2012, 02:33 PM	#80 (permalink)
Just2Good Tin Cup Champ 2004 Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Cairns Posts: 6,233 ICC Handle: Advantage FICS Handle: Advantage	Failing To Follow One's Own Advice It seems in his wisdom of the ages, Dennis is now wondering why he does the things he does. First he said this: Originally Posted by Dennis I wonder why we, or others, even bother with the Toolbpox. DJ And then, just days later, he says this: Originally Posted by Dennis I read that (OzChess) thread with a reaction like yours [sic] ... So why does he keep reading here if he wonders why he does it? __________________ . "The fox knows many things, but the hedgehog knows one big thing." ~ Isaiah Berlin ~

01-28-2012, 10:57 PM	#84 (permalink)
Firegoat7 Moderator Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Getting owned by White in the Dragon and trying to recover lost positions from shock paralysis OTB Posts: 2,044 ICC Handle: guest	Originally Posted by antichrist you would think that such a dire situation would incentivate the ACF to do some thing about it instead of making excuses as to why not get involved. But I do agree with Denis J's concerns re the correct way to do things before they become messy with fights. Australia could sponsor chess in schools there, with keen volunteers to carry out. I am still waiting for my $190! __________________ "...What I meant? Dear Mr Ian Rout (ACF news publisher) could you please put Ozchessforum in the next news letter! There is no reason to hide this forum from the Australian chess public. What they meant? Sorry, No english!- Amir Karibasic

01-20-2012, 11:26 AM	#78 (permalink)
antichrist Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Byron Bay, NSW Posts: 2,821	I am not sure if the delegate provided a report or not, I think Brian Jones asked him ?????????????

01-25-2012, 08:52 PM	#81 (permalink)
Julian Ass Member Join Date: Nov 2011 Posts: 81	25 FROM: DENIS JESSOP SENT: TUESDAY, 9 AUGUST 2011 14:32 Subject: Re: Oceania Chess Confederation (OCC) / FIDE Congress Dear Kevin and Colleagues I recall that one aspect of our concern was the possible financial liability we might incur, being the largest country in the zone. I'm not sure that we need to worry too much about that as we should perhaps be willing to help support development of chess in the smaller Oceania regions and could withdraw from the OCC if we found ourselves victimised. Mind you, to my knowledge, chess is not something in which Melanesians have taken any real interest: cf PNG whose chess players seem to be white men (5 or 6 of them and not all living in PNG) Fiji where the chess players are Indians and Vanuatu where there aren't any (either Indians or chess players) to speak of. Another matter was the need for the body at all as the Oceania Zone president could do all that was needed. I am inclined to this view and suspect ulterior motives but only because of some of those involved though the motives may be harmless. You never know with FIDE. As things now stand, the OCC statutes are awful and whether the OCC is lawfully constituted and the statutes properly accepted is not clear. Brian is not one for such niceties as he has made clear on Chess Chat so the real beauty - what is the applicable law if there is a dispute - is not addressed either. Cheers Denis

01-25-2012, 10:56 PM	#82 (permalink)
antichrist Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Byron Bay, NSW Posts: 2,821	you would think that such a dire situation would incentivate the ACF to do some thing about it instead of making excuses as to why not get involved. But I do agree with Denis J's concerns re the correct way to do things before they become messy with fights. Australia could sponsor chess in schools there, with keen volunteers to carry out.

01-28-2012, 02:57 PM	#83 (permalink)
antichrist Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Byron Bay, NSW Posts: 2,821	if the crosstable for the 93-4 is missing in ACF, now needed to enable Trevor Tao to apply for norms, could that mean that back in 94 their archivist or ratings officer did not do a proper job - or were lost in transit or flooding or fell off back of truck or the rats ate

01-31-2012, 10:40 PM	#85 (permalink)
Julian Ass Member Join Date: Nov 2011 Posts: 81	26 FROM: NORMAN GREENWOOD SENT THU, AUG 4, 2011 AT 8:35 PM Dear Shaun Many thanks for the reminder. Please note that payment of the OCC Affiliation Fee has been deferred pending an ACF Council decision thereon. In my earlier email to you I incorrectly assumed that the ACF had agreed to Affiliate. Regards Norman G

02-10-2012, 04:35 AM	#86 (permalink)
Julian Ass Member Join Date: Nov 2011 Posts: 81	27 FROM: SHAUN PRESS SENT: FRIDAY, 12 AUGUST 2011 11:00 Subject: Re: Oceania Chess Confederation - 2011 Affiliation Fees Invoice Dear Norm, I seek clarification on the points raised in your email below. Was it the case that you had received authorisation from the ACF to pay the previous invoice, or that authorisation was never given at the time of your original reply? If it is simply a matter of proper financial governance, then I assume it will be dealt with promptly.When you say the decision has been deferred, I am unsure of the time frame you are operating in. I believe there was an ACF meeting on the 31st July (ie a few days before your last email arrived). I assume that this topic was on the agenda, if only as part of the treasurers usual request to authorise payments. Was it discussed at this meeting, but a final decision held over to the next one?The timing of this is important to the Oceania Chess Confederation as we are in the process of allocating Oceania events and funding to member countries. With thanks Shaun PressTreasurer, Oceania Chess Confederation

02-10-2012, 04:36 AM	#87 (permalink)
Julian Ass Member Join Date: Nov 2011 Posts: 81	28 FROM: DENIS JESSOP SENT: FRIDAY, 12 AUGUST 2011 13:15 Subject: Re: Oceania Chess Confederation (OCC) / FIDE Congress Dear Kevin and Colleagues Another reason that was put in our letter to Brian was that we were not satisfied that the formation of the OCC had any significant benefits either for the ACF or for the other countries in the Oceania Zone whether yet members of FIDE or not. I'm not sure that we regarded Brian's response as meeting our point or, for that matter, whether we have closely considered that response. CheersDenis

02-10-2012, 11:11 AM	#88 (permalink)
antichrist Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Byron Bay, NSW Posts: 2,821	Listen Kevin, Denis and Shaun, if you guys cannot leak any juicy scandal gossip we don't want to know about it. We have enuf bores here already.

02-12-2012, 05:03 PM	#89 (permalink)
Julian Ass Member Join Date: Nov 2011 Posts: 81	29 FROM: NORMAN GREENWOOD SENT: FRIDAY, 12 AUGUST 2011 15:35 Subject: Re: Oceania Chess Confederation - 2011 Affiliation Fees Invoice Dear Tom Whilst payment of the OCC Affiliation Fee is a Treasurer matter can I trouble you to respond to Shaun as you are preparing the Council Minute re OCC matters following decisions thereon at the recently held meeting. Many thanks Norman G

02-14-2012, 06:38 PM	#90 (permalink)
Julian Ass Member Join Date: Nov 2011 Posts: 81	30 FROM: NORMAN GREENWOOD SENT: WEDNESDAY, 17 AUGUST 2011 00:40 Subject: Re: Oceania Chess Confederation - 2011 Affiliation Fees Invoice Dear Shaun Whilst payment of invoices are a Treasurer matter it is appropriate the response to your email should be by the ACF Secretary who has the responsibility of minuting ACF decisions relating to the OCC so you will be receiving a response thereon shortly. Regards Norman G

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